Performance problems with large assemblies after workstation upgrade (CREO 2.0 M210)

[Radoslav]

After upgrading my workstation to "Lenovo Thinkstation P320" (GPU Quadro P2000, Windows 10 64bit, i7 3.6GHz, 16GB RAM) I am facing serious lag problem in the large assemblies (models) in which when trying to pan, zoom or rotate it gets a few seconds for CREO to start answering to the command. Only big assemblies are affected though, small assemblies and standalone models are fine. I am working with quite big assemblies of progressive die tools with top-down design (every part and its assembly position is driven by master model, very complex layer structure, simpyfied representations in assy...).
This problem didn't exist in the same Creo 2 (with identical other programs and PC settings) on my previous workstation "Fujitsu Celsius W530" (GPU Quadro K2200, Windows 7 64bit, i7 3.6GHz, 16GB RAM) on the same assemblies. Basically, main difference is just new GPU and new Windows version, all other specs are exactly the same.

I tried to install newest driver for Quadro P2000 GPU with no success (tried to install older "CREO certified" driver as well as with no success).
I also tried to engage several config options recommended in several forum threads here with no success:
graphics opengl
use_software_opengl yes
graphics win32_gdi
spin_with_notes to no
spin_with_silhouettes to no
display_silhouette_edges to no
edge_display_quality to normal
shade_quality to 3
shade_with to no
blended_transparency to no
show_shaded_edges to no

I have also tried to work with another fresh new P320 workstation with no additional software installed, no new drivers and no personal options "private.pro" in CREO config to prevent any interference with personal settings of workstation. But the same problem occured. I have sent one example of one large assembly to local PTC dealer, with whom we have CREO maintenance contract for further investigation, but they are unable to replicate this issue on the similar hardware.

The only workaround solution I am aware of is to disable "preselection highlighting" (which helps instantly). However I do not concider this as a real solution, because preselection highlighting is crucial function for quick work and orientation in big assemblies (models and drawings also) and permanent disabling of it would have negative impact of the productivity of my work.

Any idea?

[MartinHanak]

Hi,

1.]

You use old "dead" software (CR2 M210) on PC with new graphic card (NVIDIA Quadro P2000) ... if you encounter problems, nobody can help you

2.]

I am almost sure that CR2 was not tested with NVIDIA Quadro P2000 (I can't check it because PTC web is down)

3.]

Maybe you can test graphic driver NVIDIA Display Driver for Windows 10 (64-bit) - ThinkStation P320 & P320 Tiny 23.21.13.917401 Aug 2018 available on https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/cz/en/products/workstations/thinkstation-p-series-workstations/thinkstation-p320/downloads?linkTrack=Caps:Body_SearchProduct&searchType=3&keyWordSearch=P320%20Workstation%20(ThinkStation) page

[Radoslav]

Thanks for quick reply.

You know, it is not up to me what version of CREO I have to use. In big corporation there is no chance to affect upgrade policy. I have to work on CREO 2.0 M210 on dedicated workstation:-( There is CREO 4.0 M060 upgrade planned to 2/2019. So I have to wait.

NVIDIA Quadro P2000 was listed under CREO 2.0 suported GPU on PTC site, there is also "certified driver" (377.11 in this case) recommended to use with. Not worked for me.

Anyway, I will try driver from your link and let you know if it helped.

Radoslav.

[Radoslav]

that driver not hepled too...

Radoslav.

[MartinHanak]

Hi,

heretical tip ... disable NVIDIA graphic card and use integrated Intel® HD Graphics 630 graphic 🙂

[Radoslav]

Haha, yes heretical, but who knows? Task for Monday then!

Radoslav

[MartinHanak]

Hi,

be cautious ... maybe you do not need to disable NVIDIA graphic card ... try putting display cable into connector which is located on the back of computer motherboard - I think it must belong to integrated Intel® HD Graphics 630 graphic.

[Radoslav]

...tried today to switch to motherboard GPU, very poor performance!

Anyway, I have some new info. Allegedly it is "known issue" on several other workstations in our concern (several incidents stay unresolved for 4 months),  and it is probably some misfortune combination of workstation hardware, windows 10, CREO version and CREO corporate config (we have quite extensively modified version of CREO with lots of special utilities programmed).

Change of workstation and some brute-force will be applied as a solution (32GB RAM, P4000 GPU, better CPU).

However, exact reason is not known so far and investigation continues.There is one incident of this issue opened in PTC directly.

Let you know if there will be any update to the solution...

Radoslav.

[MartinHanak]

Hi,

it is clear that there is no solution to your situation...

You have more powerful HW but it is useless to you.

[rreifsnyder]

We don't use the Lenovo computers but we've had similar issues with a few HP Zbooks. We seem to have handled it by going into the BIOS and disable the Hybrid Graphics. Lenovo might not have the exact same option but basically I think it disables the OS from trying to smartly switch between using the Nvidia and the Intel graphics and just uses the Nvidia. It's not the same thing as trying to use the "disable" in the driver section of the computer settings.

[MartinHanak]

I wonder whether LENOVO desktop BIOS contains a similar option as the HP Zbook notebook BIOS.

[Radoslav]

There is possibility to prioritize GPU in UEFI (former BIOS) under devices/video setup. Default option is AUTO, other two options are IGD (internal graphics device) and PEG (PCI-e graphics device). I've set PEG, but the problem has not been resolved...

Radoslav.

[ndele]

Hey,

Has there been any updates on this issue? We are having similar issues. We've recently upgraded a couple computers and have noticed some improvements, but feel like it's not using all of the hardware (especially the GPU). None of the RAM, CPU, GPU are close to being completely used, yet we have issues with slow performance in some areas. We've also tried using opengl and other commands to see if we can boost performance.

Intel Xeon E5-1620 (3.5 GHz), 32 GB RAM, Quadro P5000

CPU usage is between 14-20%, RAM usage is usually between 8-10 GB, and GPU is only really used when manipulating the model. Regenerations can still take a while and fatal errors still occur, but maybe not as frequently as before. Using Creo 2.0 M120.

Thanks,

Nick

[rreifsnyder]

I avoid the Xeon processors for the most part. With very few exceptions Creo is still single threaded due to it's architecture so the large number of multiple cores does not help. I use the Passmark website to examine the single thread performance of the CPU's https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_list.php . Most of the i7 chips are faster but the counter intuitive thing is that this means that sometimes you actually have to "step down" when selecting a workstation. If you don't need crazy amounts of RAM then the HP Z2 (formerly Z200) series can be faster for less money than the Z4 (formerly Z400) series.

[ndele]

Hey rreifsnyder,

Thanks for the reply. That's what I've been reading about as well, of course after the PC is built. Was hoping there might have been a different solution other than a new processor. I can't seem to find it, but Nvidia had an overview of the GPUs and showed using 'this card' compared to 'that card' equates to X amount faster (specifically for Creo) and recommended this card for larger assemblies. We used to use the K2000, so upgrading to P5000 was a huge change (the processor was upgraded a bit as well I think, but not much). It's definitely easier when panning/redefining the model, but even making animations and rendering doesn't seem to use the GPU a whole lot. Wish there was more concrete hardware recommendations, only found out about the single thread issue afterwards.

Take it easy,

Nick

[ndele]

Found it. I got a warning though about the certificate for the site though, otherwise it seems legit.

https://www.nvidia.ca/object/ptc-creo-quadro-performance.html

Other than for panning and moving around in the model space, I don't see the GPU being utilized that much. Like I mentioned before, I tried playing around with the config options to enable opengl and such. I keep my settings rather low - medium, and still big assemblies can be a bit of a pain to work with. I've already had 2 fatal errors this morning: got to keep on saving (worse part is sometimes saving results in a fatal error).