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change bars identifying a new table that breaks to new page don't identify table continuation

naglists
1-Newbie

change bars identifying a new table that breaks to new page don't identify table continuation

Make sense? The table title on the first page of the table has change bars.
When the table runs across onto a second page, the repeat title living in a
float is not change barred.

Has anyone been asked to change this behavior before? How'd you do it?

--
Paul Nagai
20 REPLIES 20

No, the DTD doesn't do that. We are using the pub touchup PI:

changed stuff goes here

Should have stated that right up front.


I meant:

changed stuff goes here

The 2nd ? inside the "close" element should have been a /


Paul,

I tried this with a chapter title because it was handy, but it seems like it should work for a table title as well. Code chgmark in an e-i-c for gi="touchup" with gitype="pi". Put the repeating float category in the e-i-c for title.

Good luck!
Suzanne Napoleon
www.FOSIexpert.com
"WYSIWYG is last-century technology!"


Here are some snippets already in the FOSI. The first is just one of
several floats in gi=title context=table:

<att>
<specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
<specval attname="landscape" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<specval attname="enumerated" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<charsubset>

<usetext<br/>source="<bold>,tableusect.txt,</bold>,<tablespace>,</tablespace>,table-title.txt,\
(continued)\">
<subchars>
<indent leftind="1.05in" firstln="*-1.05in">
<postsp minimum="5pt" nominal="5pt" maximum="5pt" condit="keep"&lt;br"/>priority="med">
<keeps next="7">
<textbrk startln="1" endln="1">
<float flidref="table-float.top" width="page" scope="table"&lt;br"/>pagetype="afterref">
<enumerat increm="1" enumid="tablepagect">
<savetext textid="tablepagect.txt" conrule="tablepagect">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charsubset>
</att>


And here's our touchup e-i-c (the last test highlights nested touchup
wrapped text yellow with the help of a sysfunc):

<e-i-c gi="touchup" gitype="pi">
<charlist inherit="1"></charlist>
<att logic="and">
<specval attname="SuppressSup" attval="no">
<specval attname="HighltScoring" attval="inherit">
<charsubset>
<chgmark barthick="2pt" join="1" type="content">
<highlt inherit="1" fontclr="black"></chgmark>
</charsubset>
</att>
<att>
<specval attname="HighltScoring" attval="off">
<charsubset>
<highlt inherit="1" fontclr="black"></charsubset>
</att>
<att>
<specval attname="attr1" attval="1">
<specval attname="my_fosi::in_touchup" attloc="system-func" attval="yes">
<charsubset>
<highlt bckclr="FFFF00" fontclr="black"></charsubset>
</att>
</e-i-c>

I can't quite suss out what changes I would need to make to do what you're
suggesting, Suzanne.


On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 5:21 PM, Suzanne Napoleon <
SuzanneNapoleon@fosiexpert.com> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> I tried this with a chapter title because it was handy, but it seems like
> it should work for a table title as well. Code chgmark in an e-i-c for
> gi="touchup" with gitype="pi". Put the repeating float category in the
> e-i-c for title.
>
> Good luck!
> Suzanne Napoleon
> www.FOSIexpert.com
> "WYSIWYG is last-century technology!"
>

Paul,

I don't see any problems with your code. It seems like it oughta work. Here's what I'd try:
* Check to be sure the floatloc is specified for the relevant page models -- maybe it's only on the opening recto, or something like that.

* Check the change mark placement on the relevant page models.
* Start style panels for the title and touchup e-i-cs and resolve them to see how the formatter is resolving the charlist.

* Try removing attspecs and see what happens.
For the record, here is what worked for me:
<e-i-c gi="title" context="chapter">
><charlist inherit="1" charsubsetref="title">
><savetext textid="chapter-title.txt" conrule="#CONTENT">
><usetext source="chapter-title.txt,\," continued\&quot;=">
><subchars>
><float flidref="continued.top" width="page" scope="chapter">
></subchars>
></usetext>
></charlist>
></e-i-c>
><e-i-c gi="touchup" gitype="pi">
><charlist inherit="1">
><chgmark ...="></chgmark>
></charlist>
></e-i-c>

Good luck!
Suzanne


One more thing: be sure the DCF allows Touchup.
Suzanne


I can't find it. I have stripped down the att, e-i-c, used other top/bot
floats, etc. (and made other changes to be sure I'm in the right one). But
nothing is passing the change bar through to the continued text / float.

Am wondering if this passage from Help 537 charsubset is relevant. I can't
understand it (I might just need lunch first).

-----

Repeatable categories are different from non-repeatable categories in that
they concatenate, or “add on” to the charlist or charsubset from which they
are called. The order of concatenation of repeatable categories starts with
the first referenced charsubset to the last referenced charsubset followed
by the charlist’s repeatable categories (if any).

Change mark, the only nonrepeating category that can contain other
categories such as content, is unique in the way it merges from a
charsubset into a charlist or another charsubset. If the content of *chgmark
* of the unit referencing a charsubset (a charlist or charsubset) is empty,
it is overlaid by the referenced charsubset’s *chgmark* (if one exists). If
the content of *chgmark* of the unit referencing a charsubset (a charlist
or charsubset) is not empty, it is retained without any changes regardless
of the number or types of categories within the referenced charsubset’s *
chgmark*.

You can think of a charsubset merging into a charlist as similar to the way
as a charlist merges into a specval. In fact, a charlist subset is exactly
what is needed for a specval and fillval to avoid special semantics for the
use of charlists in this context.
------

Huh?


On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 11:29 AM, Suzanne Napoleon <
SuzanneNapoleon@fosiexpert.com> wrote:

> One more thing: be sure the DCF allows Touchup.
> Suzanne
>

Paul,

I don't see where you are putting your table title in a float. Change bars wok fine on this eic:


<e-i-c gi="title" context="table">
<charlist inherit="0">
<leading lead="12pt">
<indent inherit="0">
<quadding inherit="0" quad="center">
<postsp minimum="8pt" nominal="10pt" maximum="12pt" priority="high">
<textbrk startln="1" endln="1">
<suppress sup="0">
<savetext textid="pagenum.tdv" conrule="pgprefix.tdv," pagect.tdv[bo]&quot;=">
<savetext textid="tabtitle.tdv" conrule="#CONTENT">
<savetext textid="tabletitle.tdv" conrule="\Table" \,=" labelstr.tdv,=" \.\,=" 1em,=" tabtitle.tdv&quot;=">
<usetext source="\Table" \,=" labelstr.tdv,=" \.\,=" 1em&quot;=" placemnt="before">
<subchars>
<presp minimum="4pt" nominal="6pt" maximum="8pt" condit="discard" priority="med">
<postsp minimum="4pt" nominal="6pt" maximum="8pt" condit="keep" priority="med">
<keeps keep="5" widowct="2" orphanct="2" next="1">
<textbrk startln="1" endln="0">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charlist>
<att>
<specval attname="pgwide" attloc="table" attval="0">
<specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
<charsubset>
<usetext source="tabletitle.tdv," \=" –=" continued\&quot;=" placemnt="before">
<subchars>
<float flidref="top-col.flt" width="col" scope="table" pagetype="next">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charsubset>
</att>
<att>
<specval attname="pgwide" attloc="table" attval="1">
<specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
<charsubset>
<usetext source="tabletitle.tdv," \=" –=" continued\&quot;=" placemnt="before">
<subchars>
<float flidref="top-page.flt" width="page" scope="table" pagetype="next">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charsubset>
</att>
</e-i-c>

-Andy

\/ AndyEsslinger LM Aero-TechOrderData
_____-/\-_____ (817) 279-0442 1 Lockheed Blvd,MZ4285
\_\/_/ (817) 777 3047 FortWorth,TX 76108-3916

Lunch didn't help me understand the Help excerpt ...

Here's my float again.

<att>
<specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
<specval attname="landscape" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<specval attname="enumerated" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<charsubset>

<usetext source="&lt;bold">,tableusect.txt,
</bold>,<tablespace>,</tablespace>,table-title.txt,\ (continued)\">
<subchars>
<indent leftind="1.05in" firstln="*-1.05in">
<postsp minimum="5pt" nominal="5pt" maximum="5pt" condit="keep"&lt;br"/>priority="med">
<keeps next="7">
<textbrk startln="1" endln="1">
*<float flidref="table-float.top" width="page" scope="table"&lt;br"/>pagetype="afterref">
*<enumerat increm="1" enumid="tablepagect">
<savetext textid="tablepagect.txt" conrule="tablepagect">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charsubset>
</att>


On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 12:44 PM, Esslinger, Andy W
<->wrote:

> Paul,
>
> I don't see where you are putting your table title in a float. Change
> bars wok fine on this eic:
>
>
> <e-i-c gi="title" context="table">
> <charlist inherit="0">
> <leading lead="12pt">
> <indent inherit="0">
> <quadding inherit="0" quad="center">
> <postsp minimum="8pt" nominal="10pt" maximum="12pt"&lt;br"/>> priority="high">
> <textbrk startln="1" endln="1">
> <suppress sup="0">
> <savetext textid="pagenum.tdv" conrule="pgprefix.tdv," pagect.tdv[bo]&quot;=">
> <savetext textid="tabtitle.tdv" conrule="#CONTENT">
> <savetext textid="tabletitle.tdv" conrule="\Table" \,=" labelstr.tdv,<br="/>> \.\, 1em, tabtitle.tdv">
> <usetext source="\Table" \,=" labelstr.tdv,=" \.\,=" 1em&quot;=" placemnt="before">
> <subchars>
> <presp minimum="4pt" nominal="6pt" maximum="8pt" condit="discard"&lt;br"/>> priority="med">
> <postsp minimum="4pt" nominal="6pt" maximum="8pt" condit="keep"&lt;br"/>> priority="med">
> <keeps keep="5" widowct="2" orphanct="2" next="1">
> <textbrk startln="1" endln="0">
> </subchars>
> </usetext>
> </charlist>
> <att>
> <specval attname="pgwide" attloc="table" attval="0">
> <specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
> <charsubset>
> <usetext source="tabletitle.tdv," \=" –=" continued\&quot;=" placemnt="before">
> <subchars>
> <float flidref="top-col.flt" width="col" scope="table"&lt;br"/>> pagetype="next">
> </subchars>
> </usetext>
> </charsubset>
> </att>
> <att>
> <specval attname="pgwide" attloc="table" attval="1">
> <specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
> <charsubset>
> <usetext source="tabletitle.tdv," \=" –=" continued\&quot;=" placemnt="before">
> <subchars>
> <float flidref="top-page.flt" width="page" scope="table"&lt;br"/>> pagetype="next">
> </subchars>
> </usetext>
> </charsubset>
> </att>
> </e-i-c>
>
> -Andy
>
> \ / Andy Esslinger LM Aero - Tech Order Data
> _____-/\-_____ (817) 279-0442 1 Lockheed Blvd, MZ 4285
> \_\/_/ (817) 777 3047 Fort Worth, TX 76108-3916
>
>

Paul,

I'm not sure whatHelp 537means either, butI don't think it applies. There is no issue with merging a chgmark in a charsubset with a chgmark in a charlist. Chgmark is coded just once.Hmmm ... is chgmark coded in the docdesc?

Suzanne


It is only in the touchup e-i-c.

And to be clear this (floated table title continuations) is the only error
I'm aware of. The remainder of the touchup coding/functionality has been
working as we expect for a very long time.

Actually, all three of my floats, do not reflect change bars. So I should
probably say change bars on floats is the only touchup problem I'm aware of.

On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 2:49 PM, Suzanne Napoleon <
SuzanneNapoleon@fosiexpert.com> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> I'm not sure what Help 537 means either, but I don't think it applies. There
> is no issue with merging a chgmark in a charsubset with a chgmark in a
> charlist. Chgmark is coded just once. Hmmm ... is chgmark coded in the
> docdesc?
>
> Suzanne
>

FWIW: My testing is in 6.0.
Suzanne

sheepishly: 5.3 m110. (I should have reported THAT much earlier, too.)

I'm moving on. Thanks for everyone's thoughts/time. If post-upgrade (next
few months, I hope), things change, I'll update this thread.

On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 3:23 PM, Suzanne Napoleon <
SuzanneNapoleon@fosiexpert.com> wrote:

> FWIW: My testing is in 6.0.
> Suzanne
>

Paul,

I encourage you to file this with tech support and see what they say. If it's a bug, maybe you'll get a fix or a workaround.

Suzanne


Paul,


To reiterate what Andy eluded to, I don't see where you're loading the title content into the variable you use in your float. Are you sure the touchup wrapper is getting into that variable to be used within the float?


Though I'm only familiar (off the top of my head) with the CPD product, everywhere I want change bars to show up, I have to wrap it with the code that causes the change bars. This includes the floats.


In each of your FOSI snippets, I didn't see where your titletext content was being wrapped or pushed through to the float usetext. I haven't had any problems that I'm aware of in having a change bar within a float and I'm still using 5.3 M060.


Just a thought.


Bob

I missed Andy's suggestion, if that's what he was getting at. So you're
saying I need to specifically resolve context of touchup and explicitly
insert that markup again into the float because when the float content is
(re)called, it resolves as not in context of the original touchup? If
that's the solution, I'll push back with my authors.

Resolving elements context of touchup requires system-funcs. I don't want
to do that on title in table.

Further, I "forced" chgmark on the e-i-c associated with the float (without
resolving context just to look at the formatting side). The change bar
displays but there is a break between it and the change bar being generated
"automatically" on the table itself. I'm not sure if I can "close" that gap
or not.

... unless I'm still missing the context of touchup advice you all are
trying to give me.

My original understanding of float was that any output of the <att> floated
goes to the float and is in-context of where it was when saved to the
float. So, in the att below, it is true, the title value is saved earlier
in the title e-i-c and I do not explicitly test for context of touchup nor
do I insert touchup into the savetext or use chgmark here on the att's
usetext. I *think* from what Suzanne has been saying (her markup doesn't
show any explicit use of chgmark or saving of touchup markup either) is
that for her, the change bars are showing up on her floated continued
chapter title because the chapter title itself is in change barred content.
Maybe I have misunderstood her, too. Anyhow, it seems to me that the
floated content shows up outside of the main flow as far as context goes
and therefore is not change barred and I have misunderstood you all
including Suzanne OR there is a bug in 5.3 m110.

<att>
<specval attname="print-only" attloc="system-var" attval="#ANY">
<specval attname="landscape" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<specval attname="enumerated" attloc="table" attval="yes">
<charsubset>

<usetext source="&lt;bold">,tableusect.txt,
</bold>,<tablespace>,</tablespace>,table-title.txt,\ (continued)\">
<subchars>
<indent leftind="1.05in" firstln="*-1.05in">
<postsp minimum="5pt" nominal="5pt" maximum="5pt" condit="keep"&lt;br"/>priority="med">
<keeps next="7">
<textbrk startln="1" endln="1">
<float flidref="table-float.top" width="page" scope="table"&lt;br"/>pagetype="afterref">
<enumerat increm="1" enumid="tablepagect">
<savetext textid="tablepagect.txt" conrule="tablepagect">
</subchars>
</usetext>
</charsubset>
</att>



On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 8:14 AM, Bob Spangenburg <
-> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> To reiterate what Andy eluded to, I don't see where you're loading the
> title content into the variable you use in your float. Are you sure the
> touchup wrapper is getting into that variable to be used within the float?
>
> Though I'm only familiar (off the top of my head) with the CPD product,
> everywhere I want change bars to show up, I have to wrap it with the code
> that causes the change bars. This includes the floats.
>
> In each of your FOSI snippets, I didn't see where your title text content
> was being wrapped or pushed through to the float usetext. I haven't had any
> problems that I'm aware of in having a change bar within a float and I'm
> still using 5.3 M060.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> Bob
>

Paul,


The content of your varaible "table-title.txt" would contain the begining and end of your change bar markup, in your case, the PI. In all the code I use, I have two variables: "scontent.txt" and "econtent.txt". These two variables are normally a null. When change bars are needed, they get filled at the e-i-c, with the change mark up if it is applicable.


However, in your case, if the title element already has the markup in the content of the <title> tag, it should be passed along to the float. The markup you're using (PI's) should then, using their own e-i-c, trigger change bars. I'd have to play with it to see why you're not getting them, since I think you mentioned early on that you were getting the bars on the first title.


Let me know and I'll see if I can get a 'non-CPD' version working to show this.


Oh, to your note about the gap... most likely, you're getting it because you're showing the bar on the content of the header row, not the row itself. When change bars are "joined," they have to be adjacent elements. There is a difference between marking the content of the row and the row itself. When multiple rows are added or deleted and marked, they'll showa solid change bar. If the content of the sames rows are deleted, but the row is left in tact, you'll get broken change bars.


HTH,


Bob

Thanks for the clarifications, Bob. I have used
element_or_condition_name_change_bar_start.txt and
element_or_condition_name_change_bar_end.txt in other instances, so I
understand that technique.

The root of my problem appears to result from the fact that I do not test
for touchup and explicitly call out chgmark at the e-i-c of any element.
The *only* chgmark I emit anywhere is from the e-i-c for touchup itself.
(We used to support change highlighting withing change bars, so that's how
I know it requires a system-func to detect touchup in context="* touchup".)

I was initially expecting that the composition engine would resolve the
float output as being in context of touchup since it is called from (and,
frankly, emitted in ... it appears to me) context of touchup. However, this
"lack" of context is true even when the entire h2 owning the table that
breaks across pages is wrapped by touchup tags. (So the gap is not the
result of only having change bars on the header text, not the row ... my
entire table is wrapped ... but in the XML content, not in my stylesheet
... and if I look closely at the output ... it appears as though the change
bar starts after the initial rule of the table header on the second page of
the table. So I now conclude that floats are "outside" the normal flow /
context at least as far as the touchup PI is concerned.

Here is an example XML psuedo-instance:
...

<h2>
<title>my h2 title</title>
<para>...</para>
<table>
<title>my table title</title>
...tgroup/colspecs/thead/tbody all go here
</table>
<para>...</para>
<newpage/>
<para>...</para>
</h2>

...

The resulting change bar is completely solid on page 1 beginning with the
title of the h2 and continuing to the last rule of the last row of the
table that fits on the page. On page 2 the change bar begins, it appears,
AFTER the first rule of the table header ... which is well after the table
title continuation ... the piece that floated. If I force a change bar on
the floated information, there is a gap after the baseline of the table
title continuation until just after the first rule of the table header.

On page 2, the change bar, once it starts is continuous to the baseline
after the post-table paragraph.

On page 3, the change bar continuously marks the post-newpage paragraph.

With the exception of the "force" test of chgmark on the float, all of this
is achieved, stylesheet-wise, by the previously included excerpts. The
<att> that floats. And the e-i-c for touchup.

Out of the box Editor change tracking, converted by an ACL to touchup PI
markup (and another ACL to remove it), controls the change bar from an
authoring perspective.


On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 11:31 AM, Bob Spangenburg <
-> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> The content of your varaible ??????"table-title.txt" would contain the
> begining and end of your change bar markup, in your case, the PI. In all
> the code I use, I have two variables: "scontent.txt" and "econtent.txt".
> These two variables are normally a null. When change bars are needed, they
> get filled at the e-i-c, with the change mark up if it is applicable.
>
> However, in your case, if the title element already has the markup in the
> content of the <title> tag, it should be passed along to the float. The
> markup you're using (PI's) should then, using their own e-i-c, trigger
> change bars. I'd have to play with it to see why you're not getting them,
> since I think you mentioned early on that you were getting the bars on the
> first title.
>
> Let me know and I'll see if I can get a 'non-CPD' version working to show
> this.
>
> Oh, to your note about the gap... most likely, you're getting it because
> you're showing the bar on the content of the header row, not the row
> itself. When change bars are "joined," they have to be adjacent elements.
> There is a difference between marking the content of the row and the row
> itself. When multiple rows are added or deleted and marked, they'll show a
> solid change bar. If the content of the sames rows are deleted, but the row
> is left in tact, you'll get broken change bars.
>
> HTH,
>
> Bob
>

Paul,

Does the document contain this:

<title>Whatever</title>

or this:


<title>Whatever</title>

The firstincludes _touchup with #CONTENT when it is saved to table-title.txt. So the change bar floats with the content.

The second would require different FOSI coding to support floated change bars, assuming it is possible with this markup combination.

Suzanne

Got it.

Thanks for the help, everyone. Sorry it took so long to get the message
through!

On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 12:08 PM, Suzanne Napoleon <
SuzanneNapoleon@fosiexpert.com> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> Does the document contain this:
>
> <title>Whatever</title>
>
> or this:
>
> <title>Whatever</title>
>
> The first includes _touchup with #CONTENT when it is saved to
> table-title.txt. So the change bar floats with the content.
>
> The second would require different FOSI coding to support floated change
> bars, assuming it is possible with this markup combination.
>
> Suzanne
>
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