Hi Hugo, This bothered me too. I asked Glenn Beer who did a presentation on Layers at Tampa (2007) where he promoted the use of Isolate. He thought it was there but then came back with this reply... "Oh! Yes! You can drag the isolate icon from the customize dialog into the text menu View>Visibilities. Where it becomes a new line item there." Why it is visible in the custom dialogue box and not in the menu in the first place I have no idea. Makes me a little worried that some folks at PTC do not really understand what Isolate does so do not worry about having it available (we thought we had lost it with the move to WF). I would like it on my RMB along with Hide and Show for layers. In the end I have also put the icon for Isolate in with all the other Layer Icons in my config.win. After suggestions from Glenn I have all my visibility Icons (datums etc, Layers, Views, View Manager) in a toolbar on the far left of my screen to the left of the model tree. His rationale is that this means the icons are always in the same location and I like this. Regards, Brent Drysdale Regards, Brent Drysdale Mechanical Designer Tait Electronics Ltd (www.taitworld.com) New Zealand Ph. +64 3 358 1093 Hugo Hermans wrote: What happened with Layer Isolate in WF4, see screenshot attached? Is there an option to make it available again? Regards, Hugo. << ProE WF3 M190 - PDMLink 8.00 M040 >>
PTC took it off the stock UI. You need to customize a tool bar to include the Isolate icon. It looks like an eye inside a dashed box. BTW It may not grouped with the other display status icons of hidden and unhidden.
I blame PTC's documentation. Everything in the online help, for layers, is absolutely accurate, and absolutely useless for learning. It is convoluted, it tries to describe the visibility results in terms of the layer UI functions only. That is not enough. I can't help but believe that the original author, didn't get it.
The documentation ignores the difference between features and entities. This dates back to when PTC was trying to differentiate Pro/E from all the other Cad programs. "Pro/E has Features, not entities" - I heard that many times. With that statement, Trainers couldn't talk about the difference. Or just didn't know. It amounts to the same thing.
The documentation also ignores how layer status interacts with basic rules governing *inherited invisibility*.
*Inherited invisibility *simply means that if an object is invisible, everything that makes up that object is invisible. Assy>parts>features>entities.
With this, an item on a layer, can impact the visibility of items not on layers. Isolate is particularly powerful in this respect. This makes it much more useful than many give credit. I find it troubling, when I hear of people writing complex sets of layer rules, when by adapting to the use of isolate, only one rule per layer may be needed.
Unfortunately, I don't think PTC will fix the documents, until there is a groundswell of enlightenment among the general population of users. Then it won't matter anymore.
On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 12:30 AM, Hermans Hugo <->wrote:
> Thank you, Glenn. Now you and someone else mentioned it, I remember it > was on the mailing list some months ago. I hope PTC wont drop it completely > in the future (although I have to admit it's use isn't widely spread). > > Regards, Hugo. > >
I can't help but wonder if there isn't someone at PTC pushing for a simpler UI, maybe looking at the competition. It's likely, as you said Glenn, that they don't understand isolate. Only having show & hide prominent makes things a lot simpler, at least they seem that way. Layers are either on or off, right? On, off and isolate is harder to explain and would lead to more tech support calls to figure it out. Hard core users will call if we remove it, but it's too hard to explain to novices, so let's bury it. Too bad there's not a PTC or PTC|User wiki where users could document some of this stuff. Doug Schaefer
Well let's be honest, here, the Pro/E help files have *never* been useful for learning any aspect of the software. They are that way intentionally - to promote a need for training and consulting.
Isolate in particular has been always been glossed over ever since I can remember. Out of all the users I've encountered over the past 15 years, I can count the number who had any idea what isolate does on one hand, and have fingers to spare. I would wager that the reason it's not on the latest UI by default is that PTC ran some audits to track how many times a function was used, and if not used often enough, moved the pick/button off the main UI.
I wanted to shed some light on the decision to move (not get rid of) the isolate command in Wildfire 4.0.
We've seen a trend by our customers to run with the layer tree undocked, and when doing so mousing between the layer tree and the layer commands in the view menu become excessive. Additionally, we sought to consolidate some of the later control and accessibility menus. In Wildfire 4.0, the layer commands (including Isolate) are now accessible in the layer tree in the "Layer" menu (the screenshot is WF 5.0, the word is replaced with an icon) as seen below.
Additionally, the command (as mentioned in an earlier post) is still accessible for inclusion in toolbars for customization.
With regard to looking at alternative means of sharing information and supporting Wiki's, forums, etc - these are all under active consideration.
Hi John, Thanks for explaining where the cheese was moved to. When I looked in the menu mapper from WF2 to WF3 and WF3 to WF4 the visibilities menu was greyed out indication no changes. I only found the icon in the customise screen after discussing with Glenn Beer. What I would really like to see is that the RMB menu comes up with exactly the same menu as the LAYER drop down menu you mention. For some reason the Isolate command is missing from the RMB menu. I suspect that other users of the Isolate command would like to see this too. Regards, Brent Drysdale Regards, Brent Drysdale Mechanical Designer Tait Electronics Ltd (www.taitworld.com) New Zealand Ph. +64 3 358 1093 Buchowski, John wrote:I wanted to shed some light on the decision to move (not get rid of) the isolate command in Wildfire 4.0. We’ve seen a trend by our customers to run with the layer tree undocked, and when doing so mousing between the layer tree and the layer commands in the view menu become excessive. Additionally, we sought to consolidate some of the later control and accessibility menus. In Wildfire 4.0, the layer commands (including Isolate) are now accessible in the layer tree in the “Layer” menu (the screenshot is WF 5.0, the word is replaced with an icon) as seen below. Additionally, the command (as mentioned in an earlier post) is still accessible for inclusion in toolbars for customization. With regard to looking at alternative means of sharing information and supporting Wiki’s, forums, etc – these are all under active consideration. Thanks,John From: Doug Schaefer [
I have not used the Isolate function in years. This thread got me looking into it again. Perhaps I know why I dropped its use (we are on WF3 / M170):
In Part mode -- Isolate works as advertised EXCEPT: Items that have been selected and hidden manually (on the "Hidden Items" layer) always stay hidden, even if a layer that contains them is Isolated. The "Hidden Items" layer cannot be isolated.
In Assembly and Manufacturing modes - I would expect Isolate to be a fast method to "de-clutter" the display and show only the layered items we are interested in. HOWEVER:
Isolating a layer (or sub-layer) only impacts the display of datums in the component that contains the layer. All other components continue to display "clutter" as per their hide/unhide status.
To "de-clutter" the display, we still have to select all other components and Hide their features.
In Manufacturing mode - Behavior is the same as Assembly mode. ADDITIONALLY: The layer tree icons don't refresh properly when using "reset status". You have to force it to refresh by manipulating the layer tree.
Dave Ford NC Programming Mgr. G.W. Lisk Co. Clifton Springs, NY 14432 (315) 462-4381
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