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Remove the Ribbon

Remove the Ribbon

The ribbon interface makes users less productive than ever before.  It requires more time and mouse clicks to do the same operations than in previous versions, despite the propoganda put out by PTC.  The ribbon UI also eliminates the opportunity for users to utilize the innate human ability to spacially recognize objects.  Limited customization options and poor use of screen space compound the issue.  Leave bad UI implementation to Microsoft, do your own useability research and build a UI that works specifically for CAD users.

Above all, remove the ribbon from future releases of Creo.

26 Comments
Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

I second that.......VERY much so.

Joerg2
1-Newbie

Hi guys,

I do not like the ribbon, but the experience shows, that many users work with it very efficient.

Proposal:

  • Create a mapkey for your daily work to close/open the ribbon.
  • Use the search functionality to reach your desired commands. (OK, there's still missing the navigation via keyboard 😞

Regards,

Joerg

Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

The INEXPERIENCED users who have been spoon-fed that microsoft garbage seem to like it.  the advanced, highly-efficient users do not.

Joerg2
1-Newbie

I fully agree ...but the question is how many users from which kind...

Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

From a company productivity standpoint, I'd say do NOT punish your experienced, productive workers.  Also, by limiting the speed of ALL the users, the new ones can then never be as productive as the experienced ones USED to be.

I can tell you the ribbon causes me to need to have easily 2 to 4 times the times needed to make drawings.  This is unacceptable.

Joerg2
1-Newbie

The main problem in the drawing mode is IMHO not the ribbon.

...and: we discuss about Creo 2, or?

Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

To me it is.  I keep trying to select things, only to remember i can't, and have to go up to the stupid ribbon, find out what tab I should be in to do what I want, instead of just being able to DO it, like I had been used to for over 15 years now.  REALLY aggravating, and time-wasting.

Joerg2
1-Newbie

Personally, I reduce the ribbon while working and use the search functionality and the context menus on RMB.

I miss the possibility to navigate through the search results via keyboard. That would reduce my time for clicking...

Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

The RMB still does NOT bring back all the old functionality.  For me, it's a huge time-waster.  We used to have the power to pick anything, and do anything to it.  Now, we must first make sure we're in the right tab, then move the cursor to perform an operation, then go find the next tab, move the cursor, pick and perform the operation, then repeat this garbage endlessly.

IceDog
1-Newbie

The ribbon is quite customizable.  I've created my own ribbon tab.  This can be done for each file type (i.e., part, assembly, drawing, sheetmetal, etc.).  After about a month of customizing the various tabs I usually don't migrate away from my custom ribbon for any one file type.  When I do switch ribbon tabs is for commands I don't use frequently and wouldn't want to have there due to potential clutter.  Also I have created some mapkeys and created icons on the ribbon. 

Most importantly the is to much momentum in the GUI world in favor of ribbons that any level of response from users will not change it's implementation, and better to adapt than be left behind.

assembly.JPG

drawing.JPG

part.JPG

Patriot_1776
22-Sapphire I

So you have to waste a month to get close to almost the productivity you had before the ribbon?  wow.  Sounds like a poor kludge at best.  Why should I have to do what PTC's developers SHOULD have done?  Also, in all previous versions, almost all the mapkeys worked from modeling mode, to assembly mode, to dwg mode.  Now, nothing that works in dwg mode will work anywhere else, although my mapkeys in modeling mode work in assy mode still.

The ribbon s#cks, and I can't stand it's implementation anywhere, although the MS products seem to do it a little better.

I've just informed management here that the new release is slowing everything down. Understandably they're not happy, but that's the software for you.  I didn't choose to go to this revision.  Were it up to me, we'd still be on WF4 and Intralink instead of crasho and windburn, and we'd be as productive as we were before, but that was a corporate decision.....

dhermosillo
13-Aquamarine

I think the biggest problem is that PTC decided to glom onto Microsoft's ribbon UI without actually doing research to see if it actually improved the user experience.  Microsoft is in the business of selling software, so planned obsolescence is part of their strategy.  They make changes just for change's sake, so they can sell the next version.  There is a lot of evidence that the Microsoft ribbon UI is actually a step back in usability.

In manufacturing, productivity is king.  PTC should have done their own research into how their software is best used and what interface increases productivity.  We've all heard and experienced that Pro/E is hard to learn, but that's because it is a professional software package that has the capability to transform ideas into usable information; it will always be complex and difficult to learn.  To saddle experienced users with training wheels that never come off is a poor implementation of a UI.

While it may initially grab the attention of executives in the short term, the end users are the ones who are reporting back that the software is getting worse and causing manufacturing delays.  And just like in the days of hyper-aggressive PTC salesmen, upper management will tire of evidence of the hits to productivity trickling up and PTC will see a migration away from their tools.  The question is, do they actually care long term or are they just working to next quarter's financial numbers?

fabio67
3-Visitor

I fully agree, remove the ribbon or put the option to revert the wf4 interface.

rmitchell-2
1-Newbie

Keep in mind, there are people that advocate for going back to cascading menus (menu manager).  Change bums people out.  Try not to be so afraid. 

Track instances where it takes more clicks.  Tell PTC your solution.  Or do what that Jim guy did.  It will take a second or two out of your day to improve your world. 

Pro Evil has much bigger issues that the ribbon.  They are falling way behind on core functionality and they know it.  Their biggest problem used to be that it was impossible to learn.  It seems that the ribbon is a step to make it easier to learn the software.

I have met people that don't want Pro to get easier.  That way these people can protect their income.  These people don't seem to realise that if things don't improve there will be no Pro E.  And what make them "Special" will be gone.

dhermosillo
13-Aquamarine

I found this article in which Neil Potter, Director of Product Design and Usability for Creo, explains the benefits of the ribbon UI.

http://creo.ptc.com/2011/03/07/behind-the-scenes-ribbon-uis-%E2%80%93-love-them-or-hate-them/

I think this summarizes his outlook perfectly, "new and casual users of Creo immediately feel comfortable because they’re used to the look and feel from other desktop software they may be using".  No where does he say that the software is -actually- made better by the ribbon, just that it is familiar to other office apps.

alouw
5-Regular Member

It really does cause a lot more clicking and searching. Even if you get use to the interface and the location of everything there are always at least 2 more clicks and 2 more searches involved with these ribon layouts. How is that more productive?

ptc-255508
1-Newbie

I don't have a problem with the ribbon because it's very easy to set up your own custom tab. I have a 'Common' tab which has all my most used tools, the ribbon tabs then make it easy to go and find less commonly used items rather then hunting drop down menus or densly packed toolbarsribbon+UI.gif

Gustavo-Cárdena
4-Participant

Ribbon bar = bad idea

PTC is made by Microsoft Developers?? If it´s true, we are lost!!!!!!

has not PTC anought fresh ideas to create a CAD software? ...doubt....

we have a stronger (stable) software? Yes.

was necesary to mess all the comands? NO, NO is NO.


is the ribbon bar the best option to work avery day more than 5 hrs and thousands of clicks? NOOOOO

PTC developers, you look like that... "developers", but you create software for USERS!!!!

users do clicks for each command and do not need more menus, bars, submenus, etc

do you understand "síndrome del túnel carpiano" ? are you trying we get it?

set up o configuration is not the problem, we do not need more "clicks"

we do not need a pretty software, we need to speed up our work procedures in Creo.

I have seen a lot of comments aganst ribbon bar, but in PTC nothing happens,

Si en PTC no entienden tantos comentarios contra el ribbon bar, ojalá que en idioma español entiendan que esa organización/estructura de los comandos NO ES PRÁCTICA para usarse.

saludos


lroose
1-Newbie

I don't think the ribbon needs to be removed but it must change.  The ribbon is more contemporary and familiar to new users of today and that may encourage new sales and boost business.  However, the user efficiency losses must be recovered.  To Frank's point, the power has been taken from the user and given to the ribbon tabs and "smart" selection filter.  The ribbon tabs should automatically switch according what I pick, NOT require me to pick a tab and then allow me to work.  This would reduce the learning curve and frustration for experienced users and is just fundamentally more efficient.  This is especially true when working on drawings.  Creo is complex and powerful and there is much to learn (which can be difficult) but it should NOT be difficult to use.  There is a difference.

dhermosillo
13-Aquamarine

@Lee, if PTC made that one simple change, " ribbon tabs should automatically switch according what I pick, NOT require me to pick a tab and then allow me to work", that would make the software so much less frustrating to use.

Milkman
3-Visitor

Sean, I too have created my own custom ribbons. I whined like everyone else in the beginning but now, with my custom ribbon and mapkeys, I am creating my models and drawings faster than ever.

STEVEG
20-Turquoise

I have been using MS Office 2010 for about 5 years now.  I STILL HATE IT.  Like everyone else said...why should I have to make my own tab.

dhermosillo
13-Aquamarine

Here's an Idea that someone threw on the pyre: https://community.ptc.com/t5/Creo-Ideas/The-User-should-have-the-choice-for-the-Wildfire-4-style-Men...

 

I'm not necessarily arguing for the return of the cascading menu system, but I know that the ribbon is a horrible interface for 3D design.

dhermosillo
13-Aquamarine

Here's an innovative interface that disappeared and was replaced with the ribbon: https://community.ptc.com/t5/Creo-Ideas/Why-don-t-add-quick-selection-wheel-from-freestyle-mode-to/i...

freestyle selection wheel.jpg

PTCModerator
Emeritus
Status changed to: Acknowledged