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Required Mathcad Maintenance

wiyosaya
1-Newbie

Required Mathcad Maintenance

Personally, I have absolutely no need for a maintenance agreement with my purchase of Mathcad. This is one MAJOR reason that I have not upgraded. I HAVE TO pay the same price with our without maintenance, even though I do not consider it necessary. As long as this policy is in place, it is highly unlikely that I will purchase a newer release of Mathcad.

19 REPLIES 19
MikeArmstrong
5-Regular Member
(To:wiyosaya)

Does this really warrant a thread?

I HAVE TO pay the same price with our without maintenance, even though I do not consider it necessary.

Well why not take it if it costs the same?

Mike

Matthew,


We are including a year of maintenance with the purchase price of Mathcad 15 and Mathcad Prime 1.0, because we want all our customers to be on maintenance. Maintenance includes

  • access to the Knowledge Base
  • Learning Center content with Mathcad Prime 1.0,
  • upgrades to any maintenance (service) releases within the year
  • technical support
  • additional support and services not available for non-maintenance users.

Mona

Matthew,

Let me add my own perspective. I've been a heavy user of Mathcad since 1997. Things have changed greatly since then.

I had single-user licenses until June 2010, when I upgraded to Mathcad 15 and signed up for a node-locked license with annual maintenance.

The node-locked license with annual maintenance allows you to install Mathcad 15 and Mathcad Prime (currently Mathcad Prime 1.0) on a primary machine and a secondary (home) machine. I am currently using both licenses. The primary machine's license is permanent, but the home license will expire after a year if I fail to renew the annual maintenance. I am into my second year of annual maintenance.

PTC issues updates to Mathcad 15 and Mathcad Prime on a periodic basis. If I recall correctly, Mathcad 15 has had three service releases: F000, M050, and M010. I installed M010 a week ago.

Without annual maintenance, you cannot get the service releases. But more importantly, without annual maintenance you have no standing with PTC (that's how I put it -- PTC is not so blunt). If you have any kind of problem, you cannot get support for it.

And I myself have had license file problems. Without paid-up annual maintenance, I could not have gotten any help.

By the way, this forum is certainly a place to complain about licensing issues, but it is not the place to resolve licensing issues. PTC's licensing department is the place, the only place. But if you do not have paid-up annual maintenance, good luck getting in touch with them.

A final note about Mathcad Prime: PTC's vision is that this new product is the future of Mathcad. It behooves anyone who is committed to using Mathcad over the long term (I myself am) to download and work with the new releases of Mathcad Prime as they come out. You get those, too, with annual maintenance.

Roger Mansfield

I, too, have been using Mathcad since the mid-90's or so.

In my experience, I have never had a problem that was so bad that I had to install a service pack to resolve it. Never. Perhaps that speaks to the quality that Mathcad has had over the years, which has, in general been very good.

However, that means that I have had no need for maintenance. Therefore, being forced to buy something that I do not need is something that I find unacceptable. Sorry, that's me. I don't need it. I don't want it, and unless there is a price drop without it, I won't buy.

I appreciate that PTC wants people to be on maintenance. However, I do see that as PTC forcing people who may not otherwise need this agreement to "contribute" to PTC when they otherwise would not. In otherwords, I see this as PTC requiring that I contribute to their revenue stream even though I get no added value.

Also, my primary use of Mathcad has been symbolic math. From what I understand, "Prime" elminates this functionality. I've seen this kind of thing before. Features are removed, and the product is billed as "better." Sorry, for me, symbolics is a must; without it, Mathcad is not of much use to me.

Finally, over the years I have had maybe one or two useage questions. These have always been answered by people in the collaboratory or other forums. So, with kind people answering useage questions, is there a need for maintenance?

Long story short, if the program crashes, then yes, a service pack is needed - though I can see where some users might encounter problems that are far less severe, however, they would like it to work right. But for me, my arm is twisted to buy what I don't want with no discount when I choose not to buy.

So, if PTC refuses to listen to me, that is their choice. I certainly do not consider that good customer relations, and it will likely result in them losing me as a customer.

Matthew,


Mathcad Prime 1.0 does not have symbolics and some other features that are in Mathcad 15, because we are developing the new interface for the Mathcad Prime series.

Mathcad Prime 2.0 will include:

  • symbolics
  • 3D plots
  • collapsible areas
  • Excel component
  • leveraging of 64-bit computer
  • multi-threading
  • new solvers
  • some other features in development.

The new features are being alpha tested now.

Mona

Thanks. I appreciate the info.

RichardJ
19-Tanzanite
(To:wiyosaya)

Sorry, but I don't get it. Many software packages come with maintenance for the first year. It's really no different to buying, for example, a new computer that comes with a one year warranty. You can't tell the computer manufacturer that you don't need the warranty, so please remove it and lower the price. It's an integral part of the product. If you want an extended warranty, that is not part of the product, and you can either buy it or not. The same is true for maintenance after the first year.

That makes two of us that do not get it.

What is the point of having an ordering option - buy Mathcad without maintenance - as at the very bottom of this web page - only to offer the option of buying the package without maintenance yet at the same price as with maintenace? Here is the "buy mathcad without maintenace" link itself. What is the point if you get the same package without maintenace for the same price? Why would anyone buy it "without maintenance" if there is no reduction in cost?

It that just there to tease those of us who are long-time Mathcad users who never need maintenance support so that we assume that we would get it for a reduced price only to find out when we get to the page that it is the same cost with or without maintenance?

IMHO, there are always a class of users of virtually any product who do not need maintenance and, as such, find no value in paying a premium price for something we will never use, but, IMHO, it is a slap in the face to that class of users to offer a "buy it without maintenance but pay for maintenance" link.

Perhaps I should ask this - beyond installing the latest service pack because the latest service pack is on the PTC web site, have you ever really needed maintenance? Has Mathcad ever crashed on you in a consistent manner that you could always reproduce? Have you ever had a useage question that only first or second line PTC support has been able to answer?

If your answer is no, then maybe you are beginning to understand what I am getting at.

Mathcad never required a maintenace contract for earlier relases. I do not need an upgrade with every service pack. In fact, I've been upgrading perhaps every two or three major releases. With a maintenace contract, I will pay more to continue to upgrade every few major releases because in order to get the release, I have to buy maintenace, or pay for maintenance, but not get it.

My apologies, here, for my strong opinons. As I see it, the bottom line is I do not need maintenance support, and I doubt I ever will; furthermore, I think it deceptive to offer it without maintenance but at the same price as with maintenance.

I agree that it's insulting to offer to sell the product without the warranty without a price reduction.

Caveat Emptor!

It would be interesting to see of the courts agreed that it was possible (and legal) to pay the same price for a prooduct without a warranty as a product with the warranty and then be denied the benefits of the warranty.

RichardJ
19-Tanzanite
(To:wiyosaya)

What is the point of having an ordering option - buy Mathcad without maintenance - as at the very bottom of this web page - only to offer the option of buying the package without maintenance yet at the same price as with maintenace? Here is the "buy mathcad without maintenace" link itself. What is the point if you get the same package without maintenace for the same price? Why would anyone buy it "without maintenance" if there is no reduction in cost?

I hadn't dug into the online store that far, and didn't notice that. It is completely illogical, and it seems to me very bad marketing.

No apology is needed, Matthew -- you make a good case. But I don't think that PTC is being deceptive. PTC is trying to make a point, too: - If you want to upgrade as a single user, you should expect to pay about what you have paid in the past for a major upgrade. But you'll not be able to download service releases and you cannot install the product on a second computer. - If you enroll in PTC's node-locked license plan with annual maintenance, you'll get the same product with a permanent license, plus a renewable home use license, plus free* service releases and tech support for one year. (*Free because the node-locked license package with one year of maintenance costs no more than the single user package. That's the other way to look at it.) At one time I had the same single-user reservations that you do. That's why I responded to your post. But after much thought and hesitation, I eventually accepted the fact that the single-user model was not working for Mathsoft, and cannot work for PTC. Sofware developers need revenue that they can count on so as to be able to hire and maintain a software development team. The software development team members are just like you and me. They need career jobs that they can count on, too. P.S. Brent Edmonds replied with pretty much the same points that I did. But I'm posting this anyway because, again, my perspective is from outside of PTC.

Is it possible that the cash flow generated by the maintenance contracts will provide PTC with the means to bring Mathcad back to its glory days?

As an enthusiastic Mathcad User since 1995 (version 5, I think), I witnessed the large growth of capabilities added between 1995 and 1999.

Unfortunately, the company did not do well after it went public (in 1999?) and succeeding versions provided only few new minor (but hyped up) features.

It is my hope that PTC will use the maintenance money to revive Mathcad to its role as a powerful, flexible and high-value rival to Matlab and Maple. If it ends up being just an add-on for its CADD products, then its on to Matlab.

It is my hope that PTC will use the maintenance money to revive Mathcad to its role as a powerful, flexible and high-value rival to Matlab and Maple. If it ends up being just an add-on for its CADD products, then its on to Matlab.

I would be patient with Mathcad as you have. What I have seen of the NEW features being added to Prime, I am impressed. I understand the frustration that Prime is not at the level of M15, but PTC have a road map and hopefully by Prime 3 - 4 we will have a fantastic product.

Mike

The intent here is to INCLUDE the first year of maintenance in the upgrade from a single user license. We took what has been the standard upgrade price of Mathcad for the past several versions (US$325 or US$425, depending on how old your latest version is) and held it at the exact same level. There are long and boring SOX related reasons why we have to spell out our internal cost of maintenance as a separate line item, but the intent is to provide the upgrader with a year of maintenance at no additional cost. In the old Mathsoft days, you'd still be spending $325 or $425 to upgrade.

The biggest benefit of maintenance, even if all the other entitlements aren't of interest to you, is access to major versional releases. Based on our current product calendar, Prime 2.0 is due in January. So upgrading now is like 3-for-1 (15.0, Prime 1.0 and Prime 2.0).

All PTC products come with a standard warranty which is separate from Maintenance. Maintenance is access to additional entitlements above and beyond a warranty period. But the analogy is a good one - if we were to remove the free year of maintenance, the price of the product would not change.

RichardJ
19-Tanzanite
(To:bedmonds)

There are long and boring SOX related reasons why we have to spell out our internal cost of maintenance as a separate line item

It's a bit hard to imagine what those could be, since many other companies include a free year of maintenance and don't split out the cost.

But the analogy is a good one - if we were to remove the free year of maintenance, the price of the product would not change.

In which case you would be making more profit. Nothing is for free, including the warranty and the first year of maintenance. But the usual marketing ploy, which an amazing number of people seem to fall for, is to say "includes a free year of maintenance", or "includes a free 1 year warranty", or "buy one and get a second one free". Of course, the maintenance, warranty, second product are not free at all. The price is simply built in to the price of the product. It's common because people actually believe they are getting something for nothing, so even though they don't need a second super-duper kazoom broom, or a year of maintenance, they think "as long as it's free I'll take it". You seem to have taken the conventional marketing wisdom and turned it completely on it's head though. You actually point out to people that the "free year of maintenance" is in fact not free at all. And then, since people then say "well, I don't want the maintenance because it's not really free" you offer the exact same product without the maintenance for exactly the same price as you would pay with the maintenance. It seems to me to almost be some sort of anti-marketing.

Richard, it seems like my last post may have confused matters further so let me take one last stab at explaining our position and the purchase options available.

Let’s start by stipulating this fact - the software price for a Single User on Mathcad 14.0 to upgrade to Prime 1.0 is $325 – that was also the price to upgrade to Mathcad 13, 14.0 and 15.0. So this level of pricing hasn’t changed in 6 years. Because the Single User product type is no longer available, we (the Mathcad Business Unit) made the strategic pricing decision to include the first year of maintenance entitlements at no additional cost. Our other option? Tack it on and charge $565 ($325 software + $240 maintenance).

So we’ve essentially created a software + maintenance ‘bundle’ at a total cost of $325. This is not unlike your cable TV bundles, where a specific price comes with a specific list of channels. Some customers may not like everything in the bundle, but there is no a la carte option – you can’t ‘unsubscribe’ from certain channels and reduce your cost.

As far as the SOX regulations are concerned, every company has their own ‘business practices’ related to how they interpret and conform with these types of regulations. PTC happens to be conservative in its interpretation, other companies are not as conservative.

RichardJ
19-Tanzanite
(To:bedmonds)

I understand the bundled pricing. It's the way it's marketed that I find very strange. In particular, I don't understand why you offer a package with the maintenance and a package without the maintenance at exactly the same price.

I also don't see why SOX has anything to do with how you price or bundle the products. SOX covers how corporate earnings are disclosed to investors, not how products are priced and marketed. But I am not a lawyer or an accountant, so the fact that I don't understand it doesn't mean much

Hello Brent,

Our mathcad maintenance contract is due to expire shortly & I have been looking for a price to extend it.

Everywhere I look seems to be happy to give info for new products & upgrade pacakges, but nothing useful in my case.

Given that over the last year the main improvement has been from Prime 1 to Prime 2 (neither of which yet matches the performance of Mathcad 15) it may be an up hill struggle to persuade 'The Boss' that the expense is warranted.

So best if we can be able to provide facts and figures to show costs / benefits /etc.

At the moment it appears that I need to contact a reseller to get a quote..., which I don't want to do until I have some agreement (in principle) that we will continue the contract.

Hoping that you can help, either a simple price or a pointer to a pricing structure from PTC would do.

Regards

Andy

Hi Andy -

I'd be happy to ask one of our Maintenance reps to reach out to you directly to discuss the benefits, options and cost structure for maintaining your Mathcad license(s). I'll send you a private message to connect.

Brent

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