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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

You have the same problem as so many collabs before and this last visitor generating 36 threads: Mathcad is not a book publisher. Your problem for magazines and book seems only possible via Latex because Mathcad does recognize only executable styles, as well as Mathematica even more limited than Mathcad. And the question goes back to my last reply: is the Latex looks like italic, is it executable in Mathcad ? and the subscript is not separable from the main name. The book styles and their national variantes are not available in any math packages. For the originator in this thread it would be unwise and useless putting so much effort in a latex dead style expecting a 1/1 executable in Mathcad or else, because none of the Mathcad or else will produce the same document and still expecting the user interprets the latex style correctly. All what that means is that the "book styles" and the "executable styles" are incompatible conjectures. That differentiates the "ISO Technocrates" from Engineers. I would compare the "ISO Technocrate" to a college level kid who had found a square of same area of a circle, thinking he had solved "La Quadrature du Cercle". Another example of the "ISO Technocrate" is a person thinking that pi comes from accurately measuring the the length of the rope around a perfect cylinder. Further, the "Naive ISO Technocrates" is such a slow organisation. What comes good out of ISO is what they unified as good from elsewhere.

jmG

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/11/2009 9:21:23 AM, jmG wrote:

>You have the same problem as

>so many collabs before and

>this last visitor generating

>36 threads: Mathcad is not a

>book publisher. Your problem

>for magazines and book seems

>only possible via Latex

>because Mathcad does recognize

>only executable styles, as

>well as Mathematica even more

>limited than Mathcad. And the

>question goes back to my last

>reply: is the Latex looks like

>italic, is it executable in

>Mathcad ? and the subscript is

>not separable from the main

>name. The book styles and

>their national variantes are

>not available in any math

>packages. For the originator

>in this thread it would be

>unwise and useless putting so

>much effort in a latex dead

>style expecting a 1/1

>executable in Mathcad or else,

>because none of the Mathcad or

>else will produce the same

>document and still expecting

>the user interprets the latex

>style correctly. All what that

>means is that the "book

>styles" and the "executable

>styles" are incompatible

>conjectures. That

>differentiates the "ISO

>Technocrates" from Engineers.

>I would compare the "ISO

>Technocrate" to a college

>level kid who had found a

>square of same area of a

>circle, thinking he had solved

>"La Quadrature du Cercle".

>Another example of the "ISO

>Technocrate" is a person

>thinking that pi comes from

>accurately measuring the the

>length of the rope around a

>perfect cylinder. Further, the

>"Naive ISO Technocrates" is

>such a slow organisation. What

>comes good out of ISO is what

>they unified as good from

>elsewhere.

>

>jmG

To jmG: it was a relatively simple question that I asked. I am not a LaTeX user and don't intend to become one. *However* LaTeX does typeset mathematical equations correctly ...where I am defining correctly as how the AMS wants them typeset and how the NIST wants them typeset. Equation editor in word, Maple and Mathematica also do the same (contrary to your misinformation or uninformed hand waving about the limitations of other software).

Mathcad may not be a publisher but neither are Mathematica or Maple and I doubt that anyone would call Word a publisher either. But when people want to prepare documents to be read by others you'd expect default formatting to comply with what appears in thousands of textbooks and hundred of thousands of journal articles.

You said you'd never seen variables italicized. I can't call that as wrong because I don't know what you have seen and not seen, but italicized variables are what appears in textbooks and journals. Occasionally forums have members who call black white and white black regardless. As to there being 36 threads it would seem to be due to some irrelevant ramblings.

>You have the same problem as

>so many collabs before and

>this last visitor generating

>36 threads: Mathcad is not a

>book publisher. Your problem

>for magazines and book seems

>only possible via Latex

>because Mathcad does recognize

>only executable styles, as

>well as Mathematica even more

>limited than Mathcad. And the

>question goes back to my last

>reply: is the Latex looks like

>italic, is it executable in

>Mathcad ? and the subscript is

>not separable from the main

>name. The book styles and

>their national variantes are

>not available in any math

>packages. For the originator

>in this thread it would be

>unwise and useless putting so

>much effort in a latex dead

>style expecting a 1/1

>executable in Mathcad or else,

>because none of the Mathcad or

>else will produce the same

>document and still expecting

>the user interprets the latex

>style correctly. All what that

>means is that the "book

>styles" and the "executable

>styles" are incompatible

>conjectures. That

>differentiates the "ISO

>Technocrates" from Engineers.

>I would compare the "ISO

>Technocrate" to a college

>level kid who had found a

>square of same area of a

>circle, thinking he had solved

>"La Quadrature du Cercle".

>Another example of the "ISO

>Technocrate" is a person

>thinking that pi comes from

>accurately measuring the the

>length of the rope around a

>perfect cylinder. Further, the

>"Naive ISO Technocrates" is

>such a slow organisation. What

>comes good out of ISO is what

>they unified as good from

>elsewhere.

>

>jmG

To jmG: it was a relatively simple question that I asked. I am not a LaTeX user and don't intend to become one. *However* LaTeX does typeset mathematical equations correctly ...where I am defining correctly as how the AMS wants them typeset and how the NIST wants them typeset. Equation editor in word, Maple and Mathematica also do the same (contrary to your misinformation or uninformed hand waving about the limitations of other software).

Mathcad may not be a publisher but neither are Mathematica or Maple and I doubt that anyone would call Word a publisher either. But when people want to prepare documents to be read by others you'd expect default formatting to comply with what appears in thousands of textbooks and hundred of thousands of journal articles.

You said you'd never seen variables italicized. I can't call that as wrong because I don't know what you have seen and not seen, but italicized variables are what appears in textbooks and journals. Occasionally forums have members who call black white and white black regardless. As to there being 36 threads it would seem to be due to some irrelevant ramblings.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

Huzzah!

However, you'll soon learn that in addition to calling white black, some people are not so easily swayed...

TTFN,

Eden

However, you'll soon learn that in addition to calling white black, some people are not so easily swayed...

TTFN,

Eden

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/11/2009 11:07:30 AM, mikej1980 wrote:

>On 8/11/2009 9:21:23 AM, jmG wrote:

....

>You said you'd never seen variables italicized.

_________________________

All my books are like yours and others, "publisher characters" looking like italicized, but aren't italics that you can reproduce from Windows delivered fonts. You let understand that you have Latex, do the exercise on the left picture, that might tell you more and final put up a Mathcad work sheet in your Latex and check if it takes. Do better, make a Mathematica Latex and check if it takes. If they don't, no point trying to publish using either Mathcad or Mathematica, because they execute only their own fonts and most of the Windows native fonts and few more registered fonts and few more partial fonts from others.

In other words to end this thread: put your Latex in the Widows FONT subfolder, check in the Mathcad sheet if it takes (you may have to run "RegTool"), make a simple test as this one.

Read all the replies and decide which publisher to use.

You confuse "publisher characters in general" and executable characters. Open any Mathematica NoteBook from their download, and make them Latex or else publisher, make an image of it with the same result and attach. Math Packages and publisher aren't the same thing. I have helped you so much, you can just figure that I know what I'm talking about.

jmG

>On 8/11/2009 9:21:23 AM, jmG wrote:

....

>You said you'd never seen variables italicized.

_________________________

All my books are like yours and others, "publisher characters" looking like italicized, but aren't italics that you can reproduce from Windows delivered fonts. You let understand that you have Latex, do the exercise on the left picture, that might tell you more and final put up a Mathcad work sheet in your Latex and check if it takes. Do better, make a Mathematica Latex and check if it takes. If they don't, no point trying to publish using either Mathcad or Mathematica, because they execute only their own fonts and most of the Windows native fonts and few more registered fonts and few more partial fonts from others.

In other words to end this thread: put your Latex in the Widows FONT subfolder, check in the Mathcad sheet if it takes (you may have to run "RegTool"), make a simple test as this one.

Read all the replies and decide which publisher to use.

You confuse "publisher characters in general" and executable characters. Open any Mathematica NoteBook from their download, and make them Latex or else publisher, make an image of it with the same result and attach. Math Packages and publisher aren't the same thing. I have helped you so much, you can just figure that I know what I'm talking about.

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

> Open

>any Mathematica NoteBook from their

>download, and make them Latex or else

>publisher, make an image of it with the

>same result and attach.

I'm not sure what part of I don't use LaTeX, never have used LaTeX, and don't plan on using LaTeX you don't understand. I presume you are being deliberately obtuse.

Attached are the images you requested, plus images for Maple and Open Office (I don't have Word on this computer). These are all default typesetting of equations. Axes labels had to be entered because the default rendering didn't have a label.

>any Mathematica NoteBook from their

>download, and make them Latex or else

>publisher, make an image of it with the

>same result and attach.

I'm not sure what part of I don't use LaTeX, never have used LaTeX, and don't plan on using LaTeX you don't understand. I presume you are being deliberately obtuse.

Attached are the images you requested, plus images for Maple and Open Office (I don't have Word on this computer). These are all default typesetting of equations. Axes labels had to be entered because the default rendering didn't have a label.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

>Axes labels had to be entered because the default rendering didn't have a label. >

__________________________

What ! Mathcad automatically shows or hides labels.

f(x) ... Mathematica equation , NO f[x]

= is a constrain in Mathcad

:= is a definition in Mathcad , not quite the same. That shows again the publisher style is to be converted to executable.

Several collabs have posted examples of the function name normal and the argument italic in Mathcad. Again, do some shopping for your best publisher, Mathcad is an active math package. Can't help not knowing what you are after. If you are in your first days of Mathcad, visit their examples. Open the *.PDF "User manual".

Are you in maths or publishing, that is the question.

jmG

__________________________

What ! Mathcad automatically shows or hides labels.

f(x) ... Mathematica equation , NO f[x]

= is a constrain in Mathcad

:= is a definition in Mathcad , not quite the same. That shows again the publisher style is to be converted to executable.

Several collabs have posted examples of the function name normal and the argument italic in Mathcad. Again, do some shopping for your best publisher, Mathcad is an active math package. Can't help not knowing what you are after. If you are in your first days of Mathcad, visit their examples. Open the *.PDF "User manual".

Are you in maths or publishing, that is the question.

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

In maths, the old DOS platform QuickBasic never had italics. The celebrat5ed 1938 German text "Tables of Functions" by Janke-Emde had sections devoid of italics.

In publishing, this is all another matter. I think MathCad is programmed without italics, and posting it is not publishing it.

Then there is uncorrected anstigmanism of the eye, that can surely make reading italics difficult and unpopular. Slanted type lines can read worse. Hence a blanket denial of italics is just either "do in Rome as the Romans do" with MathCad or an apology for bad reading glasses.

In publishing, this is all another matter. I think MathCad is programmed without italics, and posting it is not publishing it.

Then there is uncorrected anstigmanism of the eye, that can surely make reading italics difficult and unpopular. Slanted type lines can read worse. Hence a blanket denial of italics is just either "do in Rome as the Romans do" with MathCad or an apology for bad reading glasses.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

I have astigmatism (no kidding) and while I wear glasses when using the computer I have never had any trouble reading italics without glasses. The fact that I should have (trouble) is news to me.

Presumably "Rome" is defined as Mathcad, because if it were defined as the rest of the world then doing what the Romans do would mean conforming to AMS and NIST standards like other softwares do.

Presumably "Rome" is defined as Mathcad, because if it were defined as the rest of the world then doing what the Romans do would mean conforming to AMS and NIST standards like other softwares do.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

"...conforming to AMS and NIST standards like other softwares do".

____________________

I keep repeating no software do, especially Mathematica. When you read Eric web page you read CRC publisher style. But the software does not go by publisher style, rather by the executable typesetting as delivered by Windows. Attached Bernoulli from the download NoteBook, all normal or all italic, can't even separate numbers style from the letters style ... worst than Mathcad.

Post a work sheet, many collabs will do their best. Books are dead stuff like dead stones, software need be coded so the dead stones grow wings.

jmG

____________________

I keep repeating no software do, especially Mathematica. When you read Eric web page you read CRC publisher style. But the software does not go by publisher style, rather by the executable typesetting as delivered by Windows. Attached Bernoulli from the download NoteBook, all normal or all italic, can't even separate numbers style from the letters style ... worst than Mathcad.

Post a work sheet, many collabs will do their best. Books are dead stuff like dead stones, software need be coded so the dead stones grow wings.

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/11/2009 1:12:26 PM, jmG wrote:

>>Axes labels had to be entered because the default rendering didn't have a label. >

>__________________________

>

>What ! Mathcad automatically

>shows or hides labels.

>f(x) ... Mathematica equation

>, NO f[x]

>= is a constrain in Mathcad

>:= is a definition in Mathcad

>, not quite the same. That

>shows again the publisher

>style is to be converted to

>executable.

>

>Several collabs have posted

>examples of the function name

>normal and the argument italic

>in Mathcad. Again, do some

>shopping for your best

>publisher, Mathcad is an

>active math package. Can't

>help not knowing what you are

>after. If you are in your

>first days of Mathcad, visit

>their examples. Open the *.PDF

>"User manual".

>

>Are you in maths or

>publishing, that is the

>question.

>

>jmG

I've been talking all along about typesetting for documents--producing documents from worksheets etc. You keep wanting to talk about LaTeX and now programming.

FWIW here's the screen grab of an actual program in Mathematica. It contains := but like I said I have been talking about writing equations. In Maple I only use the Math mode so it is the same as I previously attached.

>>Axes labels had to be entered because the default rendering didn't have a label. >

>__________________________

>

>What ! Mathcad automatically

>shows or hides labels.

>f(x) ... Mathematica equation

>, NO f[x]

>= is a constrain in Mathcad

>:= is a definition in Mathcad

>, not quite the same. That

>shows again the publisher

>style is to be converted to

>executable.

>

>Several collabs have posted

>examples of the function name

>normal and the argument italic

>in Mathcad. Again, do some

>shopping for your best

>publisher, Mathcad is an

>active math package. Can't

>help not knowing what you are

>after. If you are in your

>first days of Mathcad, visit

>their examples. Open the *.PDF

>"User manual".

>

>Are you in maths or

>publishing, that is the

>question.

>

>jmG

I've been talking all along about typesetting for documents--producing documents from worksheets etc. You keep wanting to talk about LaTeX and now programming.

FWIW here's the screen grab of an actual program in Mathematica. It contains := but like I said I have been talking about writing equations. In Maple I only use the Math mode so it is the same as I previously attached.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

putting EVERYTHING in italics in Mathcad is quite straightforward, but is that what you need/want?

TTFN,

Eden

TTFN,

Eden

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

Ok, with some degree of difficulty:

Mathcad:

SP811:

TTFN,

Eden

Mathcad:

SP811:

TTFN,

Eden

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/10/2009 1:55:37 PM, eden_mei wrote:

>Ok, with some degree of difficulty:

>Mathcad:

>SP811:

There's at least one SP811 expression in there that can't be done as a single name, Eden.*λ*_{B} - Mathcad makes the entire name italic and won't allow the user to seperately format the (literal) subscript. One can cheat and use an indicial subscript, but that makes it difficult to search & replace, and (more importantly) means that one has to give B some dummy value to avoid getting undefined variable errors.

Stuart

>Ok, with some degree of difficulty:

>Mathcad:

>SP811:

There's at least one SP811 expression in there that can't be done as a single name, Eden.

Stuart

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

No argument there. Also, I couldn't get the hotbuttoned function names to be non-italic.

TTFN,

Eden

TTFN,

Eden

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A MathCad worksheet with variables in italics, constants in something else, and comments in a third font is too hard to read. Most high speed readers glance at a page quickly and don�t peek and poke along while mumbling to themselves.

Reading printed books and journals is another matter, much slower and more concentration is needed, not the same as reading a worksheet with involved commands and comments that runs smoothly from top to bottom.

I have personally owned some of those well known texts listed by a Forum member. I found plenty of errors in one (AMS-55) and upon taking one of them up with the editor, Ms. Irene Stegun over Legendre Functions, she left town.

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

A MathCad worksheet with variables in italics, constants in something else, and comments in a third font is too hard to read. Most high speed readers glance at a page quickly and don�t peek and poke along while mumbling to themselves.

Reading printed books and journals is another matter, much slower and more concentration is needed, not the same as reading a worksheet with involved commands and comments that runs smoothly from top to bottom.

I have personally owned some of those well known texts listed by a Forum member. I found plenty of errors in one (AMS-55) and upon taking one of them up with the editor, Ms. Irene Stegun over Legendre Functions, she left town.

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

The Alt-o,E method presented earlier is OK, and the method of editing Normal.xmct is better, IMO, although I simply made up a template that I load when I want a different look (I use several). But one of my difficulties with this subject is that Mathcad treats both variable names AND units as the same thing: variables. So even if I change the default, I still get either both non-italic or both italic, and if I want them to be separate (and I do, for all the reasons mentioned above), there is the awkwardness of changing every variable as I enter it. I made my new variable type to be aVariable, so that Alt-o,e,a gets me to a new variable type the fastest. There is not even a global search and replace for this action that I know of.

Rich

http://www.downeastengineering.com/

Rich

http://www.downeastengineering.com/

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

>>As someone new to mathcad I thought I might find some sensible discussion here.<<

You generally can. But every now and then somebody gets into their head the quaint notion of arguing with jmG. Sanity is best served by ignoring such arguments.

As to what Jean has or hasn't seen -- he posted a sheet here that included some scanned images from some reference text. These images show math constructs set in italics. Draw your own conclusions as to whether he saw that which he included in his sheet.

__________________

� � � � Tom Gutman

You generally can. But every now and then somebody gets into their head the quaint notion of arguing with jmG. Sanity is best served by ignoring such arguments.

As to what Jean has or hasn't seen -- he posted a sheet here that included some scanned images from some reference text. These images show math constructs set in italics. Draw your own conclusions as to whether he saw that which he included in his sheet.

__________________

� � � � Tom Gutman

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/11/2009 3:59:29 PM, Tom_Gutman wrote:

>>>As someone new to mathcad I thought I might find some sensible discussion here.<<

....

>As to what Jean has or hasn't

>seen -- he posted a sheet here

>that included some scanned

>images from some reference

>text. These images show math

>constructs set in italics.

>Draw your own conclusions as

>to whether he saw that which

>he included in his sheet.

>__________________

>� � � � Tom Gutman

_____________________

Not scanned, straight from the web. The question to Mike is type a Latex y in the book style and check if it does look exactly the same as the Windows unsmoothed italic. It could be that the books style would just be ignored and considered as "simply Windows italic". At 51 threads, no collab had that kind of answer, then ask PTC directly . Maybe they have an interpreter not for public or commercial use. I have been in those styles for many years with my clients, the best text and math styles were the Foxboro technical sheets, their answer to me (and my clients): proprietary ... end of it. They had their own software, with print output of their special proprietary characters a lot more beautiful and easy to read than the only FORTRAN in those years.

Sorry, can't help more w/o work sheet and the intent of it.

jmG

>>>As someone new to mathcad I thought I might find some sensible discussion here.<<

....

>As to what Jean has or hasn't

>seen -- he posted a sheet here

>that included some scanned

>images from some reference

>text. These images show math

>constructs set in italics.

>Draw your own conclusions as

>to whether he saw that which

>he included in his sheet.

>__________________

>� � � � Tom Gutman

_____________________

Not scanned, straight from the web. The question to Mike is type a Latex y in the book style and check if it does look exactly the same as the Windows unsmoothed italic. It could be that the books style would just be ignored and considered as "simply Windows italic". At 51 threads, no collab had that kind of answer, then ask PTC directly . Maybe they have an interpreter not for public or commercial use. I have been in those styles for many years with my clients, the best text and math styles were the Foxboro technical sheets, their answer to me (and my clients): proprietary ... end of it. They had their own software, with print output of their special proprietary characters a lot more beautiful and easy to read than the only FORTRAN in those years.

Sorry, can't help more w/o work sheet and the intent of it.

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/11/2009 3:59:29 PM, Tom_Gutman wrote:

>>>As someone new to mathcad I thought I might find some sensible discussion here.<<

>

>You generally can. But every

>now and then somebody gets

>into their head the quaint

>notion of arguing with jmG.

>Sanity is best served by

>ignoring such arguments.

>

yeah I have figured that. Also that mathcad typesets differently to Word, Open Office, Mathematica, Maple -- who all attempt to do it the way that AMS and NIST want it done, and make it easy to do I might add-- because that's the way it is. In all these softwares if you want to do it differently you can, just like it seems that if you want to try and do it correctly in mathcad you can (it seems), sort of anyway. I'm not sure what the point of him posting images of non-typeset stuff and of programs was for, other than red herrings, since it wasn't what I asked about.

But thanks to others who have made sane replies for me.

>>>As someone new to mathcad I thought I might find some sensible discussion here.<<

>

>You generally can. But every

>now and then somebody gets

>into their head the quaint

>notion of arguing with jmG.

>Sanity is best served by

>ignoring such arguments.

>

yeah I have figured that. Also that mathcad typesets differently to Word, Open Office, Mathematica, Maple -- who all attempt to do it the way that AMS and NIST want it done, and make it easy to do I might add-- because that's the way it is. In all these softwares if you want to do it differently you can, just like it seems that if you want to try and do it correctly in mathcad you can (it seems), sort of anyway. I'm not sure what the point of him posting images of non-typeset stuff and of programs was for, other than red herrings, since it wasn't what I asked about.

But thanks to others who have made sane replies for me.

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

If you're in the habit of requiring your sheets to look that way, you can save the prototype sheet as a template, and you can use that template for any new sheets that need to look or behave a certain way.

TTFN,

Eden

TTFN,

Eden

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08-10-2009
03:00 AM

08-10-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

>Is their a way to make MathCAD equations look like the way they do in textbooks ? <<br> _______________________

At message 35, go back with yourself and do the exercise at left. I can't tell about the smoothing, i.e: is it native from Latex or from the PDF, and if native from Latex, then install in the windows FONT subfolder and run in Mathcad. What I have said, maybe not clearly is that the Windows Italic fonts are not smoothed, thus about unreadable because the human eye Fourier transform is delayed by the cones remanance. That's what in other words Theodore is explaining too.

jmG

At message 35, go back with yourself and do the exercise at left. I can't tell about the smoothing, i.e: is it native from Latex or from the PDF, and if native from Latex, then install in the windows FONT subfolder and run in Mathcad. What I have said, maybe not clearly is that the Windows Italic fonts are not smoothed, thus about unreadable because the human eye Fourier transform is delayed by the cones remanance. That's what in other words Theodore is explaining too.

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/7/2009 4:06:40 PM, mikej1980 wrote:

>Is their a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks? .....>

_____________________________

Dozens of visitors have asked same and more, for their publisher project. Same replies in different forms ... and no work sheet to see. In PC's there is no drawer where to plug a book and no button to push for either Mathcad, Mathematica... to read the book and crunch numbers. That's the real answer, today !

jmG

>Is their a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks? .....>

_____________________________

Dozens of visitors have asked same and more, for their publisher project. Same replies in different forms ... and no work sheet to see. In PC's there is no drawer where to plug a book and no button to push for either Mathcad, Mathematica... to read the book and crunch numbers. That's the real answer, today !

jmG

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08-11-2009
03:00 AM

08-11-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/7/2009 4:06:40 PM, mikej1980 wrote:

>Is there a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks?

.......

>thanks

____________________________

Options not previously proposed:

http://www.high-logic.com/fontcreator.html

"Equation Illustrator" (search the web.

>Is there a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks?

.......

>thanks

____________________________

Options not previously proposed:

http://www.high-logic.com/fontcreator.html

"Equation Illustrator" (search the web.

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08-12-2009
03:00 AM

08-12-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/7/2009 4:06:40 PM, mikej1980 wrote:

>Is their a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks? Formulas

>and equations are normally

>typeset in italics and

>basically look totally

>different to MathCAD

>worksheets. Maple and

>Mathematica can do this so I'd

>like to know how to do it in

>MathCAD.

>

>thanks

______________________________

I noticed three distinctions: Italic, Oblique, Slant. The last Mathematica image you have seen is "slant" though in the face option it is called "italic". You can see that clearly comparing with Eden Mathcad "italic" . Some of these links will tell you everything about the actual fonts in the math market. What I have said about the readability and the human eye, others have said the same in different words, a most important factor for the "papers" and eventually work sheets. Also, I mentioned getting informed at PTC for an eventual coding, that makes sense unless some collabs can reply directly ... it makes sense as it seems that lot of these math fonts can be coded in any type characters. Adobe has the ISO but incomplete. The Post Script fonts are probably the one that will make you happy as they are "hinted" ( my expression was "smoothed" )because they are "scalable vector fonts".

My main point (other collabs too) was that Mathcad does not distinguish decorations neither in the variable name or in the argument. Mathcad only recognizes what is executable. If it would be otherwise, the confusion would be total and rendering work sheets not interpretable, also considering as many decorative styles as there would be users.

That's about a start of the "sensitive discussion/help". The next step you may be interested in is the WRI fonts. My understanding is that it will open somewhere in Windows (see the instructions) and from there you can just plug into the FONTS and you will not need the Mathematica package to have them at hand... Do I interpret correctly ? What they don't say either is with what Windows applications they will work, maybe with their math package only, I bet on that ... then you will have to purchase an expensive and specific package surely not ISO ! and probably more confusing than useful as f[x] that if you write ISO f(x) will return a blue page of errors to the inadverted user.

Read more and visit more:

.........................

http://www.tug.org/pracjourn/2006-1/hartke/hartke.pdf

http://www.appliedsymbols.com/cm/

http://support.wolfram.com/technotes/fonts/windows/latestfonts.html

READ THIS AGREEMENT CAREFULLY BEFORE PROCEEDING. IT IS AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN WOLFRAM RESEARCH, INC. (�WRI�), AND YOU. ACCEPTANCE OF ITS TERMS CREATES A BINDING CONTRACT BETWEEN YOU AND WRI.

Wolfram Research, Inc. (�WRI�) licenses Mathematica� fonts to individual users downloading from this site. All WRI fonts are copyright Wolfram Research, Inc. or its vendors. All rights reserved. WRI fonts are not in the public domain.

WRI reserves the right to control all distribution of the Mathematica fonts and does not, at this time, allow them to be widely distributed via any servers, archives, or non-WRI software products of any kind without express written consent of WRI. There are no restrictions on embedding the fonts in documents transmitted to service bureaus, publishers, or other users of WRI products. There are no restrictions on widely distributing metrics files generated from the Mathematica fonts.

WRI does not require authors to credit Wolfram Research for the use of the Mathematica fonts in published papers. However, such credit is appreciated. �Mathematica fonts by Wolfram Research, Inc.� is sufficient.

Mathematica 4.1

http://support.wolfram.com/technotes/fonts/windows/files/MathFonts_TrueType_41.exe

This file will self-extract into a folder name MathFonts_TrueType_41. You should copy these fonts into both of the following locations.

� C:\Windows\Fonts\

� C:\Program Files\Wolfram Research\Mathematica\4.1\SystemFiles\Fonts\Windows\

(If you�re using Mathematica 3.0 or 4.0, you can replace the 4.1 above with 3.0 or 4.0.)

The most recent version of the special Mathematica fonts in PostScript format is available from the following link.

ftp://ftp.dante.de/tex-archive/fonts/amsfonts/doc/amsfndoc.pdf

PostScript fonts are outline font specifications developed by Adobe Systems for professional digital typesetting, which uses PostScript file format to encode font information.

By using PostScript (PS) language, the glyphs are described with cubic B�zier curves (as opposed to the quadratic curves of TrueType), and thus a single set of glyphs can be resized through simple mathematical transformations, which can then be sent to a PostScript-ready printer. Because the data of Type 1 is a description of the outline of a glyph and not a raster image, Type 1 fonts are commonly referred to as "outline fonts". For users wanting to preview these typefaces on an electronic display, small versions of a font need extra hints and anti-aliasing to look legible and attractive on screen. This often came in the form of an additional bitmap font of the same typeface, optimized for screen display. Otherwise, in order to preview the Type 1 fonts in typesetting applications, the Adobe Type Manager utility was required.

Font hinting is the use of mathematical instructions to adjust the display of an outline font so that it lines up with a rasterized grid. At small screen sizes, with or without antialiasing, hinting is critical for producing a clear, legible text for human readers. It is also known as instructing.

For the purpose of on-screen text display, font hinting instructs which primary pixels are interpolated to more clearly render a font.

One popular and recognizable form of hinting is found in the TrueType font format, released in 1991 by Apple Computer. Hinting in TrueType invokes tables of font data used to render fonts properly on screen. One aspect of TrueType hinting is grid-fitting, which modifies the height and width of font characters to line up to the set pixel grid of screen display. The open-source FreeType font rendering engine uses an auto-hinter when such hinting data is not present or its use is restricted by a software patent.

Hints are usually created in a font editor during the typeface design process and embedded in the font. A font can be hinted either automatically (through processed algorithms based on the character outlines) or set manually. Most font editors are able to do automatic hinting, and this approach is suitable for many fonts. However, commercial fonts of the highest quality are often manually hinted to provide the sharpest appearance on computer displays. Verdana is one example of a font that contains a large amount of hinting data, much of which was accomplished manually by type engineer Tom Rickner, who also helped develop TrueType.

jmG

>Is their a way to make MathCAD

>equations look like the way

>they do in textbooks? Formulas

>and equations are normally

>typeset in italics and

>basically look totally

>different to MathCAD

>worksheets. Maple and

>Mathematica can do this so I'd

>like to know how to do it in

>MathCAD.

>

>thanks

______________________________

I noticed three distinctions: Italic, Oblique, Slant. The last Mathematica image you have seen is "slant" though in the face option it is called "italic". You can see that clearly comparing with Eden Mathcad "italic" . Some of these links will tell you everything about the actual fonts in the math market. What I have said about the readability and the human eye, others have said the same in different words, a most important factor for the "papers" and eventually work sheets. Also, I mentioned getting informed at PTC for an eventual coding, that makes sense unless some collabs can reply directly ... it makes sense as it seems that lot of these math fonts can be coded in any type characters. Adobe has the ISO but incomplete. The Post Script fonts are probably the one that will make you happy as they are "hinted" ( my expression was "smoothed" )because they are "scalable vector fonts".

My main point (other collabs too) was that Mathcad does not distinguish decorations neither in the variable name or in the argument. Mathcad only recognizes what is executable. If it would be otherwise, the confusion would be total and rendering work sheets not interpretable, also considering as many decorative styles as there would be users.

That's about a start of the "sensitive discussion/help". The next step you may be interested in is the WRI fonts. My understanding is that it will open somewhere in Windows (see the instructions) and from there you can just plug into the FONTS and you will not need the Mathematica package to have them at hand... Do I interpret correctly ? What they don't say either is with what Windows applications they will work, maybe with their math package only, I bet on that ... then you will have to purchase an expensive and specific package surely not ISO ! and probably more confusing than useful as f[x] that if you write ISO f(x) will return a blue page of errors to the inadverted user.

Read more and visit more:

.........................

http://www.tug.org/pracjourn/2006-1/hartke/hartke.pdf

http://www.appliedsymbols.com/cm/

http://support.wolfram.com/technotes/fonts/windows/latestfonts.html

READ THIS AGREEMENT CAREFULLY BEFORE PROCEEDING. IT IS AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN WOLFRAM RESEARCH, INC. (�WRI�), AND YOU. ACCEPTANCE OF ITS TERMS CREATES A BINDING CONTRACT BETWEEN YOU AND WRI.

Wolfram Research, Inc. (�WRI�) licenses Mathematica� fonts to individual users downloading from this site. All WRI fonts are copyright Wolfram Research, Inc. or its vendors. All rights reserved. WRI fonts are not in the public domain.

WRI reserves the right to control all distribution of the Mathematica fonts and does not, at this time, allow them to be widely distributed via any servers, archives, or non-WRI software products of any kind without express written consent of WRI. There are no restrictions on embedding the fonts in documents transmitted to service bureaus, publishers, or other users of WRI products. There are no restrictions on widely distributing metrics files generated from the Mathematica fonts.

WRI does not require authors to credit Wolfram Research for the use of the Mathematica fonts in published papers. However, such credit is appreciated. �Mathematica fonts by Wolfram Research, Inc.� is sufficient.

Mathematica 4.1

http://support.wolfram.com/technotes/fonts/windows/files/MathFonts_TrueType_41.exe

This file will self-extract into a folder name MathFonts_TrueType_41. You should copy these fonts into both of the following locations.

� C:\Windows\Fonts\

� C:\Program Files\Wolfram Research\Mathematica\4.1\SystemFiles\Fonts\Windows\

(If you�re using Mathematica 3.0 or 4.0, you can replace the 4.1 above with 3.0 or 4.0.)

The most recent version of the special Mathematica fonts in PostScript format is available from the following link.

ftp://ftp.dante.de/tex-archive/fonts/amsfonts/doc/amsfndoc.pdf

PostScript fonts are outline font specifications developed by Adobe Systems for professional digital typesetting, which uses PostScript file format to encode font information.

By using PostScript (PS) language, the glyphs are described with cubic B�zier curves (as opposed to the quadratic curves of TrueType), and thus a single set of glyphs can be resized through simple mathematical transformations, which can then be sent to a PostScript-ready printer. Because the data of Type 1 is a description of the outline of a glyph and not a raster image, Type 1 fonts are commonly referred to as "outline fonts". For users wanting to preview these typefaces on an electronic display, small versions of a font need extra hints and anti-aliasing to look legible and attractive on screen. This often came in the form of an additional bitmap font of the same typeface, optimized for screen display. Otherwise, in order to preview the Type 1 fonts in typesetting applications, the Adobe Type Manager utility was required.

Font hinting is the use of mathematical instructions to adjust the display of an outline font so that it lines up with a rasterized grid. At small screen sizes, with or without antialiasing, hinting is critical for producing a clear, legible text for human readers. It is also known as instructing.

For the purpose of on-screen text display, font hinting instructs which primary pixels are interpolated to more clearly render a font.

One popular and recognizable form of hinting is found in the TrueType font format, released in 1991 by Apple Computer. Hinting in TrueType invokes tables of font data used to render fonts properly on screen. One aspect of TrueType hinting is grid-fitting, which modifies the height and width of font characters to line up to the set pixel grid of screen display. The open-source FreeType font rendering engine uses an auto-hinter when such hinting data is not present or its use is restricted by a software patent.

Hints are usually created in a font editor during the typeface design process and embedded in the font. A font can be hinted either automatically (through processed algorithms based on the character outlines) or set manually. Most font editors are able to do automatic hinting, and this approach is suitable for many fonts. However, commercial fonts of the highest quality are often manually hinted to provide the sharpest appearance on computer displays. Verdana is one example of a font that contains a large amount of hinting data, much of which was accomplished manually by type engineer Tom Rickner, who also helped develop TrueType.

jmG

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08-12-2009
03:00 AM

08-12-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/12/2009 2:19:16 AM, jmG wrote:

== My main point (other collabs too) was that Mathcad does not distinguish decorations neither in the variable name or in the argument. Mathcad only recognizes what is executable. If it would be otherwise, the confusion would be total and rendering work sheets not interpretable, also considering as many decorative styles as there would be users.

Mathcad does distinguish between 'decorations' in the sense that the math style name forms part of the variable name.

The xmcd file defines the style at the beginning of the worksheet, eg mathStyle name="User 7" font-family="Tahoma" font-charset="0" font-size="12" font-weight="bold" font-style="italic" underline="false"/>

The xmcd file defines the variables in the region section, eg ml:id xml:space="preserve" font="10">x</ml:id where the "ml:id" bound the variable name and "font=" identifies which math style applies.

In Mathcad 7, the equivalents would be

.CMD DEFINE_FONTSTYLE_NAME fontID=10 name=User^7

{10:x}

Hence validating the assertion that the math style forms part of a variable name.

The main problem with the appearance of italics is due to the limitations of the Mathcad screen render coupled to what, for many, is still a fairly coarse display resolution - it's the 'staggering' of the pixels in the italic lines that creates the problem.

Try looking at the attached worksheet in 150% or 200% zoom - the fonts look much better, although still a little bit jagged (look at the radical sign).

Better yet, print it out - the italics look fine.

Or export it to pdf, Adobe Reader does a better job of smoothing the lines on screen than Mathcad does. Zoom to 100%, 150% and 200% to see the difference.

The attached worksheet also gives the Latex program that generated the text in the 'image' that I used as the basis for the 'Mathcad' content. (note default equation text is italic, \rm = roman and \bf = bold font). A Latex file is 'simply' a means of telling a Latex processor what to draw and is notionally equivalent to postscript or pdf in that sense.

The functional impact on Mathcad by providing Latex output would be about zero.

Stuart

== My main point (other collabs too) was that Mathcad does not distinguish decorations neither in the variable name or in the argument. Mathcad only recognizes what is executable. If it would be otherwise, the confusion would be total and rendering work sheets not interpretable, also considering as many decorative styles as there would be users.

Mathcad does distinguish between 'decorations' in the sense that the math style name forms part of the variable name.

The xmcd file defines the style at the beginning of the worksheet, eg mathStyle name="User 7" font-family="Tahoma" font-charset="0" font-size="12" font-weight="bold" font-style="italic" underline="false"/>

The xmcd file defines the variables in the region section, eg ml:id xml:space="preserve" font="10">x</ml:id where the "ml:id" bound the variable name and "font=" identifies which math style applies.

In Mathcad 7, the equivalents would be

.CMD DEFINE_FONTSTYLE_NAME fontID=10 name=User^7

{10:x}

Hence validating the assertion that the math style forms part of a variable name.

The main problem with the appearance of italics is due to the limitations of the Mathcad screen render coupled to what, for many, is still a fairly coarse display resolution - it's the 'staggering' of the pixels in the italic lines that creates the problem.

Try looking at the attached worksheet in 150% or 200% zoom - the fonts look much better, although still a little bit jagged (look at the radical sign).

Better yet, print it out - the italics look fine.

Or export it to pdf, Adobe Reader does a better job of smoothing the lines on screen than Mathcad does. Zoom to 100%, 150% and 200% to see the difference.

The attached worksheet also gives the Latex program that generated the text in the 'image' that I used as the basis for the 'Mathcad' content. (note default equation text is italic, \rm = roman and \bf = bold font). A Latex file is 'simply' a means of telling a Latex processor what to draw and is notionally equivalent to postscript or pdf in that sense.

The functional impact on Mathcad by providing Latex output would be about zero.

Stuart

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08-12-2009
03:00 AM

08-12-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations - LaTeX

Old, but may be of some interest to somebody. Shows how to generate a LaTeX version of a Mathcad worksheet (M11 or M2001)

http://www.tilman.de/programme/mathparser/anleitung_en.html

Stuart

http://www.tilman.de/programme/mathparser/anleitung_en.html

Stuart

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08-12-2009
03:00 AM

08-12-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

On 8/12/2009 4:30:08 AM, stuartafbruff wrote:

>On 8/12/2009 2:19:16 AM, jmG wrote:

>== My main point (other collabs too) was

>that Mathcad does not distinguish

>decorations neither in the variable name

>or in the argument. Mathcad only

>recognizes what is executable. If it

>would be otherwise, the confusion would

>be total and rendering work sheets not

>interpretable, also considering as many

>decorative styles as there would be

>users.

>

>Mathcad does distinguish between

>'decorations' in the sense that the math

>style name forms part of the variable

>name.

>

>The xmcd file defines the style at the

>beginning of the worksheet, eg mathStyle

>name="User 7" font-family="Tahoma"

>font-charset="0" font-size="12"

>font-weight="bold" font-style="italic"

>underline="false"/>

>

>The xmcd file defines the variables in

>the region section, eg ml:id

>xml:space="preserve"

>font="10">x >"ml:id" bound the variable name and

>"font=" identifies which math style

>applies.

>

>In Mathcad 7, the equivalents would be

>.CMD DEFINE_FONTSTYLE_NAME fontID=10

>name=User^7

>{10:x}

>

>Hence validating the assertion that the

>math style forms part of a variable

>name.

>

>The main problem with the appearance of

>italics is due to the limitations of the

>Mathcad screen render coupled to what,

>for many, is still a fairly coarse

>display resolution - it's the

>'staggering' of the pixels in the italic

>lines that creates the problem.

>

>Try looking at the attached worksheet in

>150% or 200% zoom - the fonts look much

>better, although still a little bit

>jagged (look at the radical sign).

>

>Better yet, print it out - the italics

>look fine.

>

>Or export it to pdf, Adobe Reader does a

>better job of smoothing the lines on

>screen than Mathcad does. Zoom to 100%,

>150% and 200% to see the difference.

>

>The attached worksheet also gives the

>Latex program that generated the text in

>the 'image' that I used as the basis for

>the 'Mathcad' content. (note default

>equation text is italic, \rm = roman and

>\bf = bold font). A Latex file is

>'simply' a means of telling a Latex

>processor what to draw and is notionally

>equivalent to postscript or pdf in that

>sense.

>

>The functional impact on Mathcad by

>providing Latex output would be about

>zero.

>

>Stuart

_______________________

Thanks for your interest Stuart,

Your Latex coding, codes directly in ORIGINLAB. It codes on a special template as well as on the plotting graphic, but I didn't use for at least 8 years and my use was limited to better displays in the graphic. Back to the WRI fonts, they are those specials characters/symbols particular to Mathematica... their interest as math equation is zero absolute 0 ! The AMSF are free, maybe worth a try for the originator... and my point here is about using them "as Mathcad executable" as far as Mathcad is receptive and if they are smoothed and if they can be coded.

Nothing to add on my part. The originator wanted "Mathcad italic", Mathcad has italic but it does not have italic because the Windows italic fonts are crappy enough to scare flies. As a byside remark, the Mathcad parentheses go by the the Verdana, i.e: for colored brackets define a user7 dunmmy variable Verdana and you will get all the brackets in color, just very distinctive.

jmG

>On 8/12/2009 2:19:16 AM, jmG wrote:

>== My main point (other collabs too) was

>that Mathcad does not distinguish

>decorations neither in the variable name

>or in the argument. Mathcad only

>recognizes what is executable. If it

>would be otherwise, the confusion would

>be total and rendering work sheets not

>interpretable, also considering as many

>decorative styles as there would be

>users.

>

>Mathcad does distinguish between

>'decorations' in the sense that the math

>style name forms part of the variable

>name.

>

>The xmcd file defines the style at the

>beginning of the worksheet, eg mathStyle

>name="User 7" font-family="Tahoma"

>font-charset="0" font-size="12"

>font-weight="bold" font-style="italic"

>underline="false"/>

>

>The xmcd file defines the variables in

>the region section, eg ml:id

>xml:space="preserve"

>font="10">x >"ml:id" bound the variable name and

>"font=" identifies which math style

>applies.

>

>In Mathcad 7, the equivalents would be

>.CMD DEFINE_FONTSTYLE_NAME fontID=10

>name=User^7

>{10:x}

>

>Hence validating the assertion that the

>math style forms part of a variable

>name.

>

>The main problem with the appearance of

>italics is due to the limitations of the

>Mathcad screen render coupled to what,

>for many, is still a fairly coarse

>display resolution - it's the

>'staggering' of the pixels in the italic

>lines that creates the problem.

>

>Try looking at the attached worksheet in

>150% or 200% zoom - the fonts look much

>better, although still a little bit

>jagged (look at the radical sign).

>

>Better yet, print it out - the italics

>look fine.

>

>Or export it to pdf, Adobe Reader does a

>better job of smoothing the lines on

>screen than Mathcad does. Zoom to 100%,

>150% and 200% to see the difference.

>

>The attached worksheet also gives the

>Latex program that generated the text in

>the 'image' that I used as the basis for

>the 'Mathcad' content. (note default

>equation text is italic, \rm = roman and

>\bf = bold font). A Latex file is

>'simply' a means of telling a Latex

>processor what to draw and is notionally

>equivalent to postscript or pdf in that

>sense.

>

>The functional impact on Mathcad by

>providing Latex output would be about

>zero.

>

>Stuart

_______________________

Thanks for your interest Stuart,

Your Latex coding, codes directly in ORIGINLAB. It codes on a special template as well as on the plotting graphic, but I didn't use for at least 8 years and my use was limited to better displays in the graphic. Back to the WRI fonts, they are those specials characters/symbols particular to Mathematica... their interest as math equation is zero absolute 0 ! The AMSF are free, maybe worth a try for the originator... and my point here is about using them "as Mathcad executable" as far as Mathcad is receptive and if they are smoothed and if they can be coded.

Nothing to add on my part. The originator wanted "Mathcad italic", Mathcad has italic but it does not have italic because the Windows italic fonts are crappy enough to scare flies. As a byside remark, the Mathcad parentheses go by the the Verdana, i.e: for colored brackets define a user7 dunmmy variable Verdana and you will get all the brackets in color, just very distinctive.

jmG

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09-27-2009
03:00 AM

09-27-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

I use sometimes Leibnitz font, from an old version of a front end for mathematica, but this font isn't free. Italics appears in 'normal' font, so, greek chars don't appears in italics.

Problem is that no body have installed this font, and there are no option to embed the font into mathcad document.

Alvaro.

Problem is that no body have installed this font, and there are no option to embed the font into mathcad document.

Alvaro.

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09-27-2009
03:00 AM

09-27-2009
03:00 AM

typesetting equations

Alvaro,

Yes, this font is free, how ?

Download the Mathematica free trial version, it will install all their fonts, and these fonts remain in the Windows. The Mathematica fonts were designed by Publicon (one of their subcontract), and at the time I got Publicon, it was free from the web. Same thing with most fonts from other sources than the Mathcd CD.

jmG

Yes, this font is free, how ?

Download the Mathematica free trial version, it will install all their fonts, and these fonts remain in the Windows. The Mathematica fonts were designed by Publicon (one of their subcontract), and at the time I got Publicon, it was free from the web. Same thing with most fonts from other sources than the Mathcd CD.

jmG