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tapped hole parameters

Re: tapped hole parameters

I am trying to get an answer from PTC.

Re: tapped hole parameters

oops, Yes Kyle if I ADD the parameter the way you did I get the same results.

I miss typed my previous answer

I do not want to be adding this on my own.

I tried changing feature_id in the *.hol file to screw_size, NO GO

I tried lying to one of the values for drill_ depth, NO GO

Re: tapped hole parameters

Thanks Domingo. That helps some. Still a few missing expanations. In Creo 2 you see there are variables for the depth symbol rather than the CTRL codes. Also "TAP" is assigned to a variable not in the hole tables (STD_HOLE_TYPE). The fact that you cannot find these anywhere in parameters or relations is strange and frustrating.

The attached files are from the help docs. One lists all the variables (okay, most all) for hole files and Callout_Format and the second talks about default callout formats in a table format. I've looked for that table but it doesn't seem to exist for editing.

Highlighted

Re: tapped hole parameters

CREO 2.0 M30

I placed a 3/8-16 tapped hole in a plate and I queried the parameters of the hole.

I see the hole has a parameter SCREW_SIZE,

I do not see this parameter in the unc.hole file and I have no idea where Creo is getting the parameters for this 3/8 tapped hole.

I can however add a column to my tree and with a screw_size parameter I can now see what the hole is in the tree.

I can live with this solution in CREO. The screw_size parameter is not available in WF4

Re: tapped hole parameters

True... I too am still trying to figure out where the "hidden" parameters are generated and maintained.

The only logic I can build on this is that the when you create the hole, it uses the hole tables to generate some hidden parameters based on certain elements within hole feature and subsequently assign pattern information "just in case" a pattern is subsequently assigned.

Somehow, I suspect the parameters belong to the note feature itself and therefore do not list when you query the hole feature. It seems you cannot do a parameter query the note sub-feature of the hole. Therefore, the most we will know is what the help pages tell us about the available feature, which can, oddly, be used for such things as generating hole notes and structure model tree columns. I'd say these hole notes require a little more transparency.

Re: tapped hole parameters

I guess &SCREW_SIZE comes from FASTENER_ID from the *.hol file. It's just a naming convention that is different for some reason there. There might simply be some sort of hidden script file in the installdir that does this conversion from used *.hol files.

These *.hol files and their connection to standart holes inside Pro/E propably went through some changes in WF5 or later. The devs propably wanted to keep the *.hol files in the same format, so they are usable in all the Pro/E versions, and maybe that's why they use this said additional hidden file for the conversion in between Creo and *.hol files.

Re: tapped hole parameters

No idea, but I want to know how to predefine a depth of a hole for example. That would be a huge time saver.

By default the standart hole depth is set to 3 times hole diameter, and that's way too deep in most cases.

Re: tapped hole parameters

True, and also the hole depth vs the tap depth. By default, the hole depth is 1.25 of the thread depth but that is easily over-written and is essentially lost upon editing the thread depth.

So yes, something in the hole algorithm is creating a lot of data based on the .hol files. We really should have access to these assumptions.

As a general rule, threaded holes require a minimum of 3x-pitch of complete threads after taking into account the lead-in chamfer/deburr cut. Bottoming taps require a finite depth beyond this. A "real" hole feature would let you check these parameters in an intelligent way. The most tedious to find is the bottoming tap requirement; the depth from the end of the end of the last full thread to either the drill point or the full diameter of the pilot hole.

A part of the hole dialog that checks to manufacturer's conformity would be extremely useful.

Re: tapped hole parameters

I think some additional transparency would be great. I've always thought that the .hol files were 50% formatting and 50% black magic. It now seems worse since PTC has wanted to change the way hole features and their parameters interact, while trying to keep the .hol formatting the same.I can understand them wanting to keep the formatting the same for legacy users, but in this case it seems to be doing more harm than good. In my opinion I think it would have been fine to change the formatting, as long as they clearly documented the change.

I think the default hole callout format is absolutely atrocious. I've wanted (for a long while now) to create new hole callout formats that are specific to each type of hole. Having a different callout feature for countersunk holes, tapped holes, and even different notes for blind and through holes. It would make my life a bit easier when making drawings. Doing so will require me to dig into the .hol files, something that I have been avoiding. My end goal of having dynamic callout features might require some inelegance within the .hol file itself, something I'm not even sure is possible. Either way this thread has motivated me to give it a shot, wish me luck.