I just started fooling around with cabling in Creo 1 and I'm already a bit frustrated. It will take me some time to figure out the new ribbon interface for cabling. The first thing I tried to do however has me very concerned. I started trying to route a network. I couldn't get to much of anything to happen so I fired up help and started to read. We typically start routing our networks with a point that is offset from the coordinate system that we assemble a connector to. What is the first thing I see under offset locations while routing networks in the help file? "You cannot create an offset location for the first location." What the hell? I have always used an offset location as the first location for my networks. This is the second thing with offset locations that PTC has messed up. The first was that in wildfire 5 you could no longer add an offset location to a random spot on a cable or network, reference it to something, and have the system automatically calculate the X, Y, and Z offsets to make the location stay there. It would jump to 0,0,0. I haven't checked to see if this is still the case in Creo 1.0. I can't get that far...yet.
What does this work flow have to do with being able to start a network segment with an offset point? Normally I route my network first so that I can try to use auto route later to get the wires to go in. I always start my networks with a location offset from a coordinate system in the skeleton that a connector will assemble to. This places my first location about 40mm off the back of the connector. Then I create a second offset location about 10mm farther out then the first one. I now have a 10mm chunk of network behind my connector. I do that for all my connectors and then go back and connect the various 10mm segments together with other piece of network routing from location to location. After that I go back and add offset locations to those and use them to locate the routing. This is where the broken offset point creation causes me problems. Our 0,0,0 location can be 2000mm or more from where I want the offset location to go. It is a major pain to have to zoom out and do multiple drags just to get it back to where I clicked on the harness. I just want it to calculate the offsets that put the location where I click on the harness relative to the reference coordinate system I chose so the harness doesn't go all wonky through 0,0,0. Cabling used to do this so I know it is possible to do. You have removed existing functionality from the cabling package thereby making it impossible for us to do our harness following methods that have worked fairly well for us.
I consider the Network, the Backbone of my routings. I like having it, so at any moment I could delete any wire and autoroute it. I do struggle sometimes with some wires, getting them to say they are complete. Or some other various problems, like bend radius all of the sudden is violated. A lot of times the fastest resolution is to delete the wire, and recreate, and reroute. So I don't understand going to a methodology of routing without the network.
Can you bundle wires not routed with a network or "follow cable", in CREO?
The datum point, or axis, or csys , in a connector model has some merit. Not sure that it will have the flexibility needed in some tight locations.
I also do work for a large corporation, and do not have write access to component models. May be an uphill battle to convince them of need for these features.
Not sure how eliminating this possibility, of starting with an offset location, helps anyone. Other then maybe stopping people who were misusing it.
So you are telling me Jim that the technical committee specifically reviewed the removal of the functionality of creating an offset point to start a network and determined that this was an enhancement to the software? This is what is stated below, but I have a difficult time believing this. Somehow I can't just get my head around the conversation that went something like: "Let's see, what "enhancements" will truly benefit the Pro/Cabling users? Oh, Oh, I know, - removing the ability to start a network using an offset point". Obviously that's not what happened and there are workarounds, but in the end the functionality was removed for still unknown and unjustified reasons.
What I would really like to know how this removal is an enhancement to the software, and what harm would it have been to leave the piece of functionality right where it was? Just because some TC folks might not use a particular aspect of the software does not mean that major vehicle manufacturing companies who route cables on a daily basis don't have this need. Some of the companies that use this offset point technique are my customers, and they are actually some of your larger customers as well.
What I am trying articulate is that Cabling design had a significant re-design which resulted in a change of workflow. I am also trying to explain the thinking behind the design and how we expected users to work with the new software. Furthermore I am owning up to a removing the functionality highlighted in this e-mail thread.
Assuming those who are pointing out the need for the omitted functionality have actually taken update training and updated their workflows to benefit from the new functionality it is clear PTC will have to investigate re-introducing the omitted functionality.
Finally just to be clear the Technical Committee do an absolutely fantastic job of guiding the product, highlighting flaws in the design and generally explaining their workflows in order to improve the product. Whilst the TC works very hard and is fully dedicated it cannot be expected to cover every workflow / industry therefore I for one would welcome those who are being vocal about the re-design to become active members of the Routed Systems TC to expand the knowledge base.
As always I appreciate the healthy discussion and welcome all good and bad feedback. As a result of this mail the concerns have been clearly understood so stay tuned!
I understand your perspective of the Technical Committee. When we first started using RSD about 5 years ago there were some obvious short comings in the software that our Industry (FA&D) thought was common practice. I had many discussions with Jim and was told the same kind of story you are hearing now, the T/C pointed the software in a specific direction and this is what the out come was. I soon joined the T/C and have become a thorn in Jim's side ever since!
When the re-design for Cabling was coming together it was looked at as a total redesign, and because of that, the "way I have always done it before" had to be thrown out the window and looked at from a new perspective.
The Routed Systems Technical Committee is always looking for more active members. We have many new plans on the horizon and getting as many people involved from different Industries will only make the future products that much better.
The Technical Committees meet twice a year "Face to Face". Once in January at PTC Headquarters in Needham, MA, and then again after the PlanetPTC Live Conference in June. Throughout the year we will have teleconferences to discuss specific topics that the T/C or PTC would like to discuss. I plan on trying to hold at least monthly calls so we can keep in touch on a regular basis.
Ok well I now have to hold my hands up and apologize for forgetting that the new functionality I highlighted in my very first response ("We made an improvement which allows you to define the type of location you want to create prior to creation. So now you can select offset select the references then drag the location into place, you can also use the repeat command to add a second offset location") does allow you to set your first location as an offset location.
I would also like to thank PD for highlighting my forgetfulness and again I apologize for not remembering.
Attached is a movie showing the picks and clicks using the dashboard and the using the right click option.