Intersect curves issue

[jeffsampson]

body{font-family: Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color: #ffffff;color: black;}Okay Guru's. I'm doing something in WF4 that I haven't done in a while, and am getting results different than I remember. Can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong here?
I've made 2 sketches, then use INTERSECT to create a 3D curve out of the two. This puts them in a group under the intersect automatically. I don't like that, but understand. The problem is they are now locked and I can't do anything with them. I wanted to copy the curve as a new one, so I could create a similar intersect with different dimensions: NO DICE. The new intersect refers to the same 2 sketches no matter if I check Dependent or Independent.I cannot copy either of the sketches individually, as once I pick one it automatically picks the intersect and sketches as a group. If I delete the intersect, the 2 sketches are deleted with it. I cannot get my sketches back. I had the same thing with a sketch that I subsequently extruded. I couldn't get the sketch back even when deleting the extrude. What kind of stupid behavior is this?
I thought I recall a check box that allows "keep internal features" when deleting a feature, but I don't see that here. Any feedback? any config settings that I have wrong?
TIA,
Jeff

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[BrentDrysdale]

Hi Jeff,
Ok so WF4 was quite a while ago but think I can remember that the
underlying issue here is using features or using geometry (this was a
change when we went to WF per se).

So maybe try using the geometry filter to select the sketch then make a
copy before doing your subsequent operations. This should allow you to
still work on your original sketches.

Can't try it for you in WF5 as I have a large assy open.


Regards,

*Brent Drysdale*
*Senior Design Engineer*
Tait Communications

[dgschaefer]

The sketches should still exist in the tree where they were and be available for other uses. They will just be hidden. It’s possible your model tree is set not to show them. Go to Settings > Tree Filters and make sure ‘Used Sketch’ isn’t cleared:

[cid:image001.png@01CE19C0.1091F820]

--

[jeffsampson]

The sketches are still there, though they have their feature number removed and are "consumed" into the Intersect feature (have to click on the '+' symbol to see them in the MT). But they are locked up. I can't do anything with them. If I do what Brent suggests, I can have multiple copies of the same sketch, but I have to do that Jeff

In Reply to Doug Schaefer:

The sketches should still exist in the tree where they were and be available for other uses. They will just be hidden. It’s possible your model tree is set not to show them. Go to Settings > Tree Filters and make sure ‘Used Sketch’ isn’t cleared:

[cid:image001.png@01CE19C0.1091F820]

--

[nrollins]

This must be a config setting or something. I may not be able to offer any
real help, but coincidentally, today I am in WF4 and I made a 3D curve using
intersecting curve with two sketches. I can confirm what Doug says was true
for me. The original sketches remained - hidden (grayed) - but fully there
and modifiable. After deleting the intersection, the originals were still
there. I am 95% sure I selected the feature to create the intersection -
not the geometry.



Woah.



This just in.



I just tried to create a curve intersection by selecting the geometry - as
Brent suggested - and I got the behavior that Jeff is seeing. Eff - with a
capital E.



What are they thinking? The original sketches get absorbed into the feature
and cannot be extracted. They disappear from the tree. They can be edited
with a RMB in the tree. But, get this - any other children of that original
sketch receive an absorbed copy of the curve - I am not sure if the
children's copies are linked. I don't think I care to learn either. Maybe
someone out there can explain WHY this is useful? I promise to listen and
consider. Seems pretty stupid to me.



Jeff, you need to create your intersection curve by selecting the feature -
NOT the geometry. This will solve your issue - methinks.



Screen looks like this when selecting the FEATURE of the curve (red):

[BrentDrysdale]

Hi Nate,
I learned the Geometry V Feature lesson very hard in the transition from
R2001 to WF2. One evening I had a choice selection for what WF meant
(think WTF). The surrounding air was as blue the background that evening.
Indelible experience.
Since that time I use the selection features as you say; I even have
mapkeys that set them as that is quicker. Generally now I try it one way
then the other to see what works.

Though I have Creo 2 loaded I have not spent much time on it yet. We have
maintenance issues and till those are sorted on our side we won't be moving
to Creo 2. On the plus side that means we are a few releases into Creo 2
so hopefully really stable 🙂


Regards,

*Brent Drysdale*
*Senior Design Engineer*
Tait Communications

[dgschaefer]

Nate,

Can you give me a step by step on how you duplicated what he did? I created two sketches, selected the two features and selected edit > intersect. I then created two more sketches, selected the sketch geometry (fat red line) of the two and selected edit > intersect. I got the same result:

[cid:image001.png@01CE1A4B.4FF61600]

If I change the model tree display like I showed earlier I see this:

[cid:image004.png@01CE1A4B.C72652D0]

I can still edit or edit definition on all the sketches, however.

--

[jeffsampson]

The plot thickens..... When I do it, it doesn't matter whether I select Geometry or Features, I get the same (undesired) result. The sketches are locked up in the new intersect feature and I can't get them out. I'm convinced now it is a config setting, I just don't know which one.

BTW, yes, when you edit one version of the sketch, it updates all of the versions as they are all the same sketch.

I have a workaround solution for this issue, but it ain't pretty: You have to c

Convoluted? yes, but then again we are talking about Pro here.

In Reply to Nathan Rollins:

This must be a config setting or something. I may not be able to offer any
real help, but coincidentally, today I am in WF4 and I made a 3D curve using
intersecting curve with two sketches. I can confirm what Doug says was true
for me. The original sketches remained - hidden (grayed) - but fully there
and modifiable. After deleting the intersection, the originals were still
there. I am 95% sure I selected the feature to create the intersection -
not the geometry.



Woah.


This just in.


I just tried to create a curve intersection by selecting the geometry - as
Brent suggested - and I got the behavior that Jeff is seeing. Eff - with a
capital E.


What are they thinking? The original sketches get absorbed into the feature
and cannot be extracted. They disappear from the tree. They can be edited
with a RMB in the tree. But, get this - any other children of that original
sketch receive an absorbed copy of the curve - I am not sure if the
children's copies are linked. I don't think I care to learn either. Maybe
someone out there can explain WHY this is useful? I promise to listen and
consider. Seems pretty stupid to me.



Jeff, you need to create your intersection curve by selecting the feature -
NOT the geometry. This will solve your issue - methinks.


Screen looks like this when selecting the FEATURE of the curve (red):

[nrollins]

Hi Doug,



In your second screen shot, are hidden features turned off in your tree -
and that is all? In my experiment, I selected two sketches (feature) -
orthogonal to each other - and the original sketches became hidden (expected
/ desired behavior) Then I deleted the intersect feature and selected
geometry of the same two sketches. Then my tree looked similar to your
second screen shot - the features (e.g. "sketch1") were no longer found in
the tree, but expanding the intersect feature revealed the two sketches
inside (different icon, but the name was retained). These embedded features
were also found in other children of the original sketch and deleting the
intersect feature did not put the original sketches back in the tree.



Now, I just spent 15 minutes investigating this.



Creating a new part and trying to duplicate the behavior did not produce
evidence of what had happened. So I went back to the original part I tried
it on and could NOT DUPLICATE the behavior. Maybe it only happens on
Tuesdays.



Seriously, I was so frikken mad that this happened to my real part and that
I had not saved it before trying this yesterday. I killed the part and
reverted back to my last saved and learned that I had some amount of work
that was lost. I really did verify that I was not hallucinating and that
the features were not in the tree. And now I cannot make it happen.



Maybe action>object vs. object>action?

Brent, what else do you know about this?



.pull my hair out.

[jeffsampson]

Now that Nate is seeing both behaviors, I'm totally stumped. I was about to suggest it might be different builds of WF that do this (I'm on WF4 M190) but now I'm not so sure.

I'm going bald at the same rate as Nate about now.....

Nate - sorry to have messed up your work yesterday.

Jeff

[nrollins]

This is one of those fun things that keeps us making the Big Bucks, right.
When junior guys say "It won't let me." and you say "Oh, just click here"
and they say "wow, how did you learn that?"



I am intrigued and wish I had more time to reproduce the issue. or try to.



WF4 M210 here. Doug?



No worries on the lost work - it's always quicker (and cleaner) the second
time.



-Nate

[dgschaefer]

Yes, the only difference between the two screen shots is the unchecking of the 'Used Sketches' pick in the model tree display settings.

In fact, you'll notice that 'intersect1' is feature #7 in both images.

I'm on M190.

Jeff - Did you check that model tree display setting?

--

[BrentDrysdale]

Hi Nate,
Sorry but nothing to add really. Your comment about how we learn the nitty
gritty is good though. Still waiting for the big bucks.


Regards,

*Brent Drysdale*
*Senior Design Engineer*
Tait Communications