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Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

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Newbie

Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

It reminds me of CAD programs that are 10-12 years old.

Can you install an add-in that can optimize the program? 🙂

19 REPLIES 19
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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

We would love to hear your opinion on what YOU think is an up-to-date CAD program.

Also, if you think Creo3 is old-fashioned, state WHY you think so. Nothing is gained by making a negatory comment without reasons why!

If you are new to Creo3, what is your prior CAD experience, if any?

I have been using CAD for almost 40 years, Applicon, Computervision Cadds4/4X, CATIA V5, Unigraphics 2/UG NX for 20 years, SolidWorks, Pro/Engineer since 2001 and maybe some others along the way.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

I've used many other cad systems. (>30 years)

I used ProE back in 20001-2003, it was not user intuitive, when compared to Solidworks, Catia V5, Inventor, and another in-house developed program.

  I'm now using Creo 3.0, and I'm surprised by the lack of new development work on the user interface.  It takes several mouse clicks/holdkey (Ctrl or Alt) to accomplish what can be done in one or two mouse clicks in the others.  The ribbon requires you to make more selections to access a similar command.  I've also found out using the same extra-large assemblies is no better in Creo 3.0 than SolidWorks 2016.  Each has it's own Idiosyncrasies, but the fact that it takes longer (more user inputs) to do an operation in Creo 3.0 than in others, means it is not conducive to doing things fast.  I.M.H.O.

 

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

But what a CAD programs for you is new-fashioned? We're all intrigued.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

We have worked with Creo for a long time.

We think that everything is better in for example SolidWorks 2016.

Everything takes a long time in Creo. There is no intuitiveness in Creo. Creo reminds me of SolidWorks 1996 or Windows 95.

🙂

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

OK,  I'll throw in my $.02 on this one...

First I'll say I know my perspective is a little biased.  I've been on Pro/E-Creo for 20 years,  and specializing in complex surface modeling for 16+ of that.  (plastics... vehicle interiors - class A vehicle exteriors - and complex structural castings with multiple interior cores)

I have recently (3 months) taken on a new client that has already committed to SolidWorks.  They want me to do heavy structural weldments and some other things,  but mostly weldments.  So,  I decided this might be a nice change of pace to take on as a side job.   I purchased a license of SW2016 went through all of the training video's and was surprised at how fast I picked up the basics.  Then I tried to actually design something...  I soon found out that the interface is sooooo different from Creo that I was not efficient...  AT ALL...   Things that would take me 20min in Creo were taking me 2 hrs in SW.    Searching through menus to find commands, learning what the command icon's look like, finding where to input information...   do I use the big green check box on the right,  or the little green check box on the left...   How do I know things are fully constrained while in sketcher mode...   It feels like I'm using creo sketcher without intent manager!    Very inefficient and very frustrating for me...

So,  how did I overcome...   I hired a SolidWorks Guy!

Now that I have seen SW in action by someone who is actually familiar with the software I will say that I'm pretty impressed with a couple of things,  and not so much with others.  

On the plus side---  multi-body weldment structures...  building 3D sketches and applying pre-defined structural shapes for beams and channels then merging and trimming the ends to create a complete weldment. Then being able to output a complete cut list from this structure...   WOW!   Way faster than I could have ever done it in Creo.   SW is definitely the right software package for this particular client.

On the not-so-plus side---  sketcher constraints 2D, and worse in 3D...  Its very easy to throw out a shape and let it float,  but it is very hard to explicitly control your design intent with proper dimension schemes and constraints.  Again,  It feels like Creo sketcher without intent manager...   And as good as my SW guy is, I see him struggle with this every day!  Also,  Complex surface modeling...   its just not there yet.  It reminds me of some of the struggles I faced in Pro/E surface modeling 16 years ago...  There is so much power and flexibility in what I can design now (and still explicitly constrain and control) that SW could not even dream of keeping up.  IMO!

So, with what I've learned in the last 3 months...

Is Creo old-fashioned and SW new-fashioned??...  IE:  Is Creo better than SW, or is SW better than Creo?

My answer:  It depends on what your doing!

Bernie

Bernie Gruman

Owner / Designer / Builder

www.GrumanCreations.com

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

I followed about this same path.  Long time Creo owner, UG NX, and recently a SW license.  UG was paid for so no foul.  Great package!  but I had to tell SW that I could not maintain their version of maintenance.  Not only is the software seriously lacking in usability and capability, SW depends on the VARs to provide support.  In order to report a serious bug, you have to go out of your way to tell the VAR to focus on the problem, not finding any possible way to not have to talk to SW proper.  I was asked why I didn't use SW with their collaboration tools, when I told the sales manager that I depend on Creo for drafting and that no converter will ever bring drawings in clean from Creo.  That the sales manager understood.

There is a lot in SW that Creo could adapt but I suspect they are locked in IP battles of simple functions.  Midplane constraints; 3D Sketches; unmerged solids... but they don't make up for the lack of sketcher features; reference types; layout...

Pro|E is enjoying it's 3rd makeover.  I think SW is catching up to Creo on the UI.  At this point, the only archaic part of Creo is the outdated apps that still have a WF or Pro|E interface.  That is still a fit & finish problem with Creo.  In my view, an embarrassing one.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Well stated Bernie,

We have had similar experiences but we work more with large assemblies and simulation and not with surfaces. We require the "fully defined sketches" option to be turn on in SW.

I am curious though ..... want is your experience with application and model stability of the two? Does one crash more often or do "good" model fail for some unknown reason when opened in future versions?

Kevin

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Kevin,   This is kind of a different discussion but...

I cant really speak for both.  Haven't used/observed SW in action long enough to really have a feel for stability.  Nor are we doing anything too complex with it that I would expect might make the software struggle.

Creo on the other hand is WAY more stable then it used to be.  I remember the old days when it was common to get kicked out 3 or 4 times a day.  My coworkers and I used to joke that if Pro/E didn't kick you out...  you're weren't working hard enough!    Now that I think about it,  I can hardly remember the last time Creo kicked me out.  Its been at least a month ago...   (In my mind this is a testament to Creo code, but also hardware and driver stability of a really good machine)  As for upward compatibility,  Creo has been very good.  Date code revs are rarely a problem (I might even say almost never)  and major revs are only a problem when PTC chooses to change the functionality of a feature.  (tweak replace comes to mind)  But these are also usually not a problem if your simply opening or reviewing an older model.  It only becomes a problem when you force a regen or try to modify something about the model...  Then you can expect to spend some time rebuilding.    Again,  Its WAY better now and the issues it does have now are issues that I would expect to see when working with older models.

Hope that helps.

Bernie

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

If given the option between SW or Creo we have chosen Creo based on the instabilities we have experienced with SW. Creo has proven to be more profitable in large part to its stability (We recently reused a sub-assembly released in 1994 [I am definitely one of the old-dogs]. Saving the customer a good chunk of cash which reinvested in a version 2 of the product).

I responded as a question in order to avoid biasing any responses (and to avoid embarrassing myself if we were the only ones having this issue) ..... but I was really making a statement.

My apologies for leading the topic astray.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

The only thing that is old fashioned is our attitudes LOL

Creo is nothing short of an impressive set of communication tools.

Bart Brejcha

Design-engine.com

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

LOL  Agreed!

I remember being the youngest punk in the office.

When did it happen that I became on of the "old dogs"?

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

I can tell you that I have a lot more corruption in SW files.

I've lost 2 files in 5 years due to unresolved corruption (sent to PTC for analysis).

In SW, I've lost many files and that is in less than a year.

The VAR was of no help, and I doubt it ever made it to SW proper.

Easiest way to corrupt a SW file is to install a McMaster-Carr Screw downloaded in .sldprt format.

It won't be immediately obvious, but you loose the ability to hide feature types.

Removing the offending part from the assembly will not solve the issue.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Both Systems crash.  Its usually a combination of mouse clicks and your video card that causes the crash.  With Creo we save incrementally.  So If I crash while saving a file I only corrupt the last save.  If i crash SW during a save I often need to start over.  The truth is experts save more often and when the system crashes we laugh because we just saved.

Bart Brejcha

Design-engine.com

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Crashes I can deal with.

Both SW and Creo appear to crash about in about the same way and about as often.

Something about confusing the buffers specially with intensive graphics in the buffer.

Us old timers have a simple phrase stuck in our heads... "save when you think about it"...

This is what you learned when crashing CAD 20 times a day was normal.

Today, I normally crash either Creo or SW by trying new features or feature options.

Rarely will either system crash with conventional development.

Caveat: My systems are certified for both CAD applications.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Antonius Dirriwachter wrote:

Caveat: My systems are certified for both CAD applications.

Certified does not equal more stable. (just throwing that out there, it may not have been what you meant).

Yeah I hit save after almost every feature creation, but this is habit from way back in the Autocad days on slow computers when you did something and the computer may or may not let you keep drawing.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Just saying that unqualified configurations aside...

Creo is very touchy about platform anyway.

Having always had PTC certified systems, I'd say that I've come to understand the "norm" for rating stability.

From an overall reliability rating, where I put UG NX at 10, PTC would rate a high 8's.

SW (from me) gets a passing grade but pushing hard to get past the high 7's.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Antonius Dirriwachter wrote:

Creo is very touchy about platform anyway.

My experience has actually been opposite, to a point anyway. Thinking about it though it's basically what I said. I have used a LOT of hardware configurations to run Creo(Pro back then of course) and it always runs fine from a hardware stand point. BUT in saying that, almost all hardware was better quality then what is generally a "certified" system AKA an off the shelf system. So, yeah, makes sense when I think about.

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

Steven,

That's one of the things I love about my job...   Even after 20 years, I'm still learning about new things because the hardware, software, and competition between software's keep evolving!   I'd like to think I'm pretty good at what I do,  but the software capabilities are so vast that I don't believe anyone could ever be and expert at everything...

Honestly,  I didn't even know there was an AFX.

Again, my history with Creo is primarily complex surfacing work.  My welded structures client is new to me and they were already in bed with SW,  so I hired a SW guy to help me.

Creo AFX looks to be very similar to SW capabilities for welded structures,  but I can't speak to how it compares because I have not used it.

Thanks for the info!

Bernie

Bernie Gruman

Owner / Designer / Builder

www.GrumanCreations.com

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Re: Why is Creo3 so old-fashioned?

I  love my job too and it's because I can help people learn new skills.  + I never stop learning.

Bart Brejcha

Design-engine.com

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