Configuration Management of Released state parent models in Windchill. Cannot regenerate released parent models in Creo if child part was revised.

[ldutoit]

Hi we're currently reviewing our model change management process and need to know what is good industry standard best practice w.r.t. the following example(Please refer to pdf example). For example let say a Creo part on a indent level 3(BN3 Rev C) needs to change. The part is interchangeable in all "where used" parent models.Hence only revision change to this part is needed. In Windchill PDM Link the part will get revised( to BN3 rev D) and checked out of Windchill to make appropriate changes in Creo session. After changes is made the part gets checked into Windchill again and promoted to a Released state.

My question is how does companies handle the parent CAD models in the Creo/Windchill environment for a child revision example as explained above? For instance if I open a Released parent model in Creo(lets say Model BN4 RevA) the 'As stored model' will be opened in Creo showing the old BN3 Rev C child model. The BN4 model can not be regenerated since it is kept in a Released state. The only way to capture the BN3 Rev D model change is to revise the BN4 parent model to allow model to regenerate. To capture the BN3 Rev D change in all the 'Where Used" parent models all higher level parent models needs to be revised so as to be put into In-Work state to allow Creo regenerate to run. We call this process Revision Tumbling. This creates a massive administrative nightmare due to all the drawings that needs to get signed off again. So how does other companies handle this? According to configuration Management principles when a changed is made on lower level model, that does not effect interchangeability,a company should only have to revise that specific model. No other revision changes of higher level parents should have to happen. Do companies except that higher level parent drawing illustrations of BN3 will be out of date?

My 2nd question relates to how does companies manage Windchill publishing of all the parent models after the BN3 Rev C change. Our company is setup to publish BN3 Rev C on promotion to Released state. This will update the BN3 vieweable but all the parent vieweable models will still be out of date. What is the best method to use to ensure all parent assemblies vieweables are up kept up to date? Can we use positioning assembly option in Windchill better? We need some kins of automated solution to keep our illustrations current as best possible

Thanks for any inputs on this duscussion.

[ldutoit]

Revising all assemblies creates a huge administrative burden for design office ito drawings that needs to be signed-off again even though it was only a small revision change that happened on a lower level not effecting interchangeability. In worst case scenario in our company we've had to revise 180 parent assemblies due revising one common component on an indent level 7. Is there nobody that has created a solution to solve this issue? We're seriously considering not doing revision tumbling in higher level assemblies. Hence leaving higer level assemblies out of date untill need for it to be revised arrises. What do we need to be careful off if we follow this approach? Does business out there really except this administrative burden of manual 'Where used' parent assembly model Revise =>check-out=>Regenerate=>check-in=>Promote To Release=>sign-off parent assembly drawing? I suppose the only way to keep properties like the weights of parent assemblies up to date is to regenerate all the parent models but this will require to revise all of them. Anybody tried setting up an automated server solution for after work hours that would keep a log queue of all Release state promoted parts for the day? The server starts running a sequential task list that would do a "Set State" to In-Work on parent models =>Check-Out=>Regen=>check-in=>Set State to previous Released state? This might be something to look at but we're scared to test this on our Windchill production server.

[hwientjes]

Hello Lourens,
I understand your question; I have the same question but also another related very important one;
How do you handle the form, fit, function(FFF) modifications in Windchill/CREO. The whole downstream process(ERP system) tells me to take a new identification but as a designer I want to see in the history all modifications for a specific design part. This means FFF changes and Non-FFF changes.
To me as a designer the Non-FFF changes are shown in the history in Windchill but they are less interesting to me.
To me as a designer the FFF changes are not shown at all in Windchill when I have to take another identification. And these are the interesting changes to me.
So how do you handle the complete change history including Non-FFF and FFF changes in Windchill for a specific design WT-Part and how is this connected to the CREO-part. Do you use the "hard" or "soft" link between WT-Part and CREO-part?
Best regards,
Han

[kjohns101]

we always pull the "latest released" so the latest released top assy will pull the latest released sub components if their revison rolled, it still would require a checkout regen and check in, so when the top assy is on a ECO all rev's are up to date

[DonSenchuk]

Windchill does track what number a part was copied from.

In 10.1 go to the new part number's Information Page > New Tab > Customize Menu > History > Save As History.

This will give you the [new] Number - Saved From - [old] Number.

[cid:image001.png@01CFCCDA.C9D8D000]

[ldutoit]

Hi Han, I think I understand your question. We have not investigated how to link the history of FFF changes to each other. We know this as supersession cause current identification gets superceeded by new one. found a post on here that state Windchill10.2 has functionality that caters for this type of history.http://portal.ptcuser.org/p/fo/st/topic=16&post=119197#p119197

[DonSenchuk]

Han brings up a great point here.

The way to get this is to pick the information icon ([cid:image002.png@01CFCCE4.9213BA90]) in the table and drill backward through the history. I'm not sure if getting what he mentions is possible or not with something like Query Builder.

I suppose even if a list like Han shows was possible, the designer would still have to visit each information page to either print out the drawing or open the model and investigate the older designs. That Save-As History table doesn't even allow any actions except to visit the individual information pages. Because of this, the method available - picking each information icon in turn - doesn't really add much burden to the designer or time to the process of investigating older designs.

Interestingly, when you do this you get a list that shows not only what the file was saved from, but also what else it was saved to. (Well, interesting to me because I didn't know this previously!)

[cid:image001.png@01CFCCE5.02DB0940]

I'm guessing this presentation of both Saved From and Saved To would be a limiting factor in showing every level for every piece in the table. In organizations where Save As is happening a lot the table would become so big it would no longer be useful.

[davehaigh]

Question, where is the Saved To/Saved From information coming from? Windchill or Creo?

In Creo, you can do a Replace, By Copy. Which copies the File to a new name, and replaces it in the assembly. The file is still fully constrained just like the old item it replaced.
If the drawing for the original part had the same name as the part the drawing is also copied to the new name. At that point you can make your changes.

By the way, with I say part & name, I mean the Creo part, ie, the filename. As a designer, all I care about is the filename, the name & number are unimportant to me.

David Haigh

[DonSenchuk]

I'm pretty sure it's from Windchill. The number I used as a sample had the Save As done in Windchill. Though I have to admit I didn't test it with either Replace By Copy or with Creo Save As. I was just going from what I had immediately available.

[Zoltán]

No real answer to this still, right?

[avillanueva]

Old post but I'll bite. We work up the chain but stop at revisions (or interchangeability to be more generic). Our drawings are published as-stored and we check to make sure the latest items at that time of release are present. This means I can in theory destroy that representation and rebuild it and it should be the same (barring purging). Chasing latest and out of date status seemed pointless. 

Our numbering convention (last 3 digits) handles FFF or part number changing but they are correct that Windchill knows nothing about this. On our CNs, -002 may exist on affected items while -003 replaces it in the resulting items. If your number system did not track this, make use of supersede link:

https://support.ptc.com/help/wnc/r12.0.2.0/en/#page/Windchill_Help_Center%2FPMPartSupersedeOview.html%23