Disappearing parts

kwsauter · ‎Mar 05, 2010

I have a recurring problem with disappearing parts (WF3 M160). I just
imported a part from 3Dcontentcentral, then suppressed the import
feature to add datums, then unsuppressed the import feature, and nothing
showed up. It was in the model tree, but nothing on the screen. I have
had similar things happen where a part or an entire assembly just
vanishes, and I can't figure out how to get it back. Does anyone else
have this problem?

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
-

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kwsauter · ‎Mar 08, 2010

I solved my problem but I forgot how. It was the usual pro/workaround
module that solved the problem, even though I didn't figure out exactly
why the part was disappearing. I have listed the responses I got
because they may help the next person to have this problem. My original
post is below, followed by the responses.

I have a recurring problem with disappearing parts (WF3 M160). I just
imported a part from 3Dcontentcentral, then suppressed the import
feature to add datums, then unsuppressed the import feature, and nothing
showed up. It was in the model tree, but nothing on the screen. I have
had similar things happen where a part or an entire assembly just
vanishes, and I can't figure out how to get it back. Does anyone else
have this problem?
******
Is it possible you have a rule set up that's automatically adding the
import feature to a hidden layer?
***
One thought. Turn off shaded mode. If the wireframe of the parts show
up, the parts are at 100% transparency.
I had parts that mysteriously went away and we found this to be the
problem.
I never figured out if it was a software glitch or a prankster...
Good luck
***
Check to make sure that you are not hiding all surfaces in a layer.
Often imported models are only surfaces.
***
The way I would debug the issue is to delete the datums and see if the
imported feature appears again. If so maybe the unit is screwed up where
the imported feature is too tiny. I would start with the datums first
and then import the part.
Also try unhide all the layers...sometimes when you import features it
comes with certain layers. If that's not it, then make sure you are in
the master rep.
Good luck.
***
Not sure this is it, but one possible cause is a part accuracy issue.
You could try dialing the accuracy value down to see if that helps.

Good luck,

***

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
-

NOTICE: This e-mail transmission (and/or the attachments accompanying
it) may contain confidential or proprietary information belonging to DRS
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"This (document/presentation) may contain technical data as defined in
the International Traffic In Arms Regulations (ITAR) 22 CFR 120.10.
Export of this material is restricted by the Arms Export Control Act (22
U.S.C. 2751 et seq.) and may not be exported to foreign persons without
prior written approval from the U.S. Department of State."

kwsauter · ‎Mar 08, 2010

It happened again. The process is this:

1. Import part from Internet.
Geometry shows up in model tree as "Neutral id X" with a
coordinate system immediately before that feature. Model looks exactly
like I want.
2. Suppress "neutral id X" (I do this to get three default datums
before the feature, otherwise I get only one datum after the feature.
3. Insert>model datums>plane. Three default datums show up.
4. Unsuppress "neutral id X".
5. Wonder where the feature went. Nothing shows up. Nothing I do
brings it back.

In response to the replies I got:

Is it possible you have a rule set up that's automatically adding the
import feature to a hidden layer?
There are no rules set up that I know of.
***
One thought. Turn off shaded mode. If the wireframe of the parts show
up, the parts are at 100% transparency.
I had parts that mysteriously went away and we found this to be the
problem.
I never figured out if it was a software glitch or a prankster...
Good luck
I changed the display to wireframe and still nothing showed up.
***
Check to make sure that you are not hiding all surfaces in a layer.
Often imported models are only surfaces.

There is only one layer: "01_ALL_PLANES". Nothing is hidden.
***
The way I would debug the issue is to delete the datums and see if the
imported feature appears again. If so maybe the unit is screwed up where
the imported feature is too tiny. I would start with the datums first
and then import the part.
Also try unhide all the layers...sometimes when you import features it
comes with certain layers. If that's not it, then make sure you are in
the master rep.
Good luck.
I deleted the datums and regened. Nothing. I also deleted the csys and
regened. Again, nothing. No layers are hidden.
***
Not sure this is it, but one possible cause is a part accuracy issue.
You could try dialing the accuracy value down to see if that helps.

Good luck,

The accuracy was .0012. I changed it to .0001 and regened. Nothing.

Nothing worked. I think what I did before was to erase all from memory,
then pull it up again.

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
-

NOTICE: This e-mail transmission (and/or the attachments accompanying
it) may contain confidential or proprietary information belonging to DRS
Technologies or the sender. The information is only for the use of the
intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any
action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
prohibited. Any unauthorized interception of this transmission is
illegal under the law. If you have received this transmission in error,
please promptly notify the sender by reply e-mail, and then destroy all
copies of the transmission.

"This (document/presentation) may contain technical data as defined in
the International Traffic In Arms Regulations (ITAR) 22 CFR 120.10.
Export of this material is restricted by the Arms Export Control Act (22
U.S.C. 2751 et seq.) and may not be exported to foreign persons without
prior written approval from the U.S. Department of State."

kwsauter · ‎Mar 08, 2010

here's a mystery: I used the part imported from the emn file, which
already had datums in it. Deleted the block that came in.
Insert>shared data>merge/inheritance, then browsed to the (.prt file)
model that has the geometry. the model showed up in yellow right where
I wanted it; I selected 'default' then clicked the green check mark, and
nothing showed up. The part is empty.

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->

mainman · ‎Mar 08, 2010

I need to model a garter spring in a loop. Does anyone have any
suggestion on how to do this?

Sincerely,

Rick L.
Design Draftsman: Husky Corporation

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amedina · ‎Feb 23, 2012

Does anyone have a solution for this old post?

I'm having the same problem. One of the users either suppresses or tries to
edit definition on a neutral feature import and when you resume it or come
back to it its gone. This works on simple neutral file X or complex models.
Does anyone know the magic bullet for this?

regards,

Alfonso

On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Sauter, Kenneth W (SA-1) <
-> wrote:

> **
> here's a mystery: I used the part imported from the emn file, which
> already had datums in it. Deleted the block that came in. Insert>shared
> data>merge/inheritance, then browsed to the (.prt file) model that has the
> geometry. the model showed up in yellow right where I wanted it; I
> selected 'default' then clicked the green check mark, and nothing showed
> up. The part is empty.
>
>
> Ken Sauter
> DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
> Infrared Technologies Division
> PO Box 740188
> Dallas, TX 75374
> 214-860-6826
> -* <->
>
> NOTICE: This e-mail transmission (and/or the attachments accompanying it)
> may contain confidential or proprietary information belonging to DRS
> Technologies or the sender. The information is only for the use of the
> intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any
> action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
> prohibited. Any unauthorized interception of this transmission is illegal
> under the law. If you have received this transmission in error, please
> promptly notify the sender by reply e-mail, and then destroy all copies of
> the transmission.
>
> "This (document/presentation) may contain technical data as defined in the
> International Traffic In Arms Regulations (ITAR) 22 CFR 120.10. Export of
> this material is restricted by the Arms Export Control Act (22 U.S.C. 2751
> et seq.) and may not be exported to foreign persons without prior written
> approval from the U.S. Department of State."
>
>

EileenTung · ‎Feb 23, 2012

Hi,

Try turning on all your layers.

Regards,

Eileen

amedina · ‎Mar 15, 2012

Ok continuing the case of the lost parts...

Seeing as I get no good response from anyone on this, I thought I would
find a simple part with the problem in it. Here is one such part attached.
I'll give a hug to anyone who can suppress and un suppress the Neutral id 4
feature that forms the L bracket in this part. I'll give another hug to
anyone who can explain why and show me how to do it.

All hugs are limited time and supply only. I got one left. Its an old hug
but its still works. darn! I just hugged my self by accident thinking about
this problem again. I guess I can spare a couple of pats in the back.

regards,

Alfonso

On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Sauter, Kenneth W (SA-1) <
-> wrote:

> **
> here's a mystery: I used the part imported from the emn file, which
> already had datums in it. Deleted the block that came in. Insert>shared
> data>merge/inheritance, then browsed to the (.prt file) model that has the
> geometry. the model showed up in yellow right where I wanted it; I
> selected 'default' then clicked the green check mark, and nothing showed
> up. The part is empty.
>
>
> Ken Sauter
> DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
> Infrared Technologies Division
> PO Box 740188
> Dallas, TX 75374
> 214-860-6826
> -* <->
>
> NOTICE: This e-mail transmission (and/or the attachments accompanying it)
> may contain confidential or proprietary information belonging to DRS
> Technologies or the sender. The information is only for the use of the
> intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
> notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any
> action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
> prohibited. Any unauthorized interception of this transmission is illegal
> under the law. If you have received this transmission in error, please
> promptly notify the sender by reply e-mail, and then destroy all copies of
> the transmission.
>
> "This (document/presentation) may contain technical data as defined in the
> International Traffic In Arms Regulations (ITAR) 22 CFR 120.10. Export of
> this material is restricted by the Arms Export Control Act (22 U.S.C. 2751
> et seq.) and may not be exported to foreign persons without prior written
> approval from the U.S. Department of State."
>
>

BrentDrysdale · ‎Mar 16, 2012

Hi alfosno.
I use Creo Elements/Pro 5 M100.
Like you If I suppress this neutral feature in the model I cannot resume it
without error.
I see a warning about Layer Rules
70_SURFACES in 173425.PRT contains a rule for items that are not supported
by layers.
Which may be part of the problem but have no idea how you deal with this;
looks like something embedded in the Neutral feature.

I don't know if it is a work around but would it help to open a blank part
and bring this part in as an Inheritance feature? I tried this and I can
suppress the Inheritance feature based on this part however same problem
with suppressing the Neutral feature unde the Inheritance feature.

What is this neutral feature based on? Are you importing a neutral .neu
file into your default template part? If this is the case maybe try
opening it without the template.

Not much else I can think of.

Regards,

*Brent Drysdale*
*Senior Design Engineer*
Tait Communications

TomU · ‎Mar 16, 2012

Doing anything to the neutral feature seems to cause its geometry to disappear. Changing units, changing accuracy, or doing edit definition on the neutral feature will all cause the geometry in the neutral feature to disappear. Deleting the layers doesn't help. Tried this in both WF5 M120 and Creo 1.0. Out of ideas...

Tom U.

amedina · ‎Mar 16, 2012

This is the most intrigging reply yet Rui.

I don't have the part. But it seems that you know what happens when you got
the solidworks part and when you don't... do tell.

I've red a few of the replies saying that PTC does not want to regenerate
solidworks imported part features(neutral feature) and so they just make
the geometry magically disappear. Accordingly some time ago PTC made pro/e
crash if this was encountered. Recent WF4 versions only make the
feature disappear. Both solutions are equally useless and more than just
useless, I would say dangerous. We deal with very complicated geometry and
for these guys to just remove features at will on their production software
is just wrong. I got an idea for them -Just don't put it in- fix it first.

Alright, I'm going to have something to eat now. happy Friday!

regards,

Alfonso

DeanLong · ‎Mar 16, 2012

I pulled the original part file in, exported and read back in an IGES and a STEP file with no issues. The layers came back in hidden as the orginal file as well.

Weird issue but you can export and read back in parts that give you this goofy behavior.