Drawing Program User Guide, Tutorial and Hands-On Workshop

[nalexandru]

Hi, everyone,

As it seems that there is not much help on

Drawing Program

, I decided  to open up a new discussion about this.

What I know until now:

- the documentation of Creo 4.0 (I use Creo 2.0- does anyone where I can find that?)

Creo Parametric Help Center

-the fact that

• A drawing program can only have up to 80 characters per line.
• Characters input beyond 80 will be automatically truncated
• Line continuation characters are not accepted by drawing program

(courtesy of Tom that pointed me to this: https://support.ptc.com/appserver/cs/view/solution.jsp?n=CS34738#_ga=1.116686790.1914719267.1490615705 )

So, the question is:

Is there any Tutorial and/or Hands-On Workshop for Drawing Program?

as I found for the Pro/PROGRAM:

Tutorial: Pro/PROGRAM Primer

Pro/PROGRAM Tutorial

https://d2t1xqejof9utc.cloudfront.net/files/13343/Pro_Program_HOW.pdf?.. with the models files downloaded from here:

https://d2t1xqejof9utc.cloudfront.net/files/13344/proe_data.zip?1342610431 taken from here:

how to use pro/prgram in ptc creo or proe wilfire 5.0 - GrabCAD

I will start searching for something similar to update the discussion.

Keep in touch,

Nic.

[nalexandru]

not yet. I am still doing by trying, without a clear methodology of how to do it.

[SYNDAKIT]

So this is a dimension created in the drawing that was then erased and now you want to show it using the drawing program?

[nalexandru]

Hi, again, my friend

Very nice to put a note to see what state is active. i have to do this operation for all my 109 states on one model and more than 300 on the other!!

I've changed some parameters name so almost ALL of my symbols are different from the old ones. Is there a method to replace a symbol wit another one? How would you advice me to manipulate the new configuration with the new symbols that on the old custom symbols are simply deleted and apear as *** ?

Thank you again for your time and help

[manjunathrv]

Now that I have created my first drawing program, I have some issues that I don't understand if it is the limitation.

The purpose of my program is to CREATE a Note if the drawing is in Design State. When the drawing state changes to any other state this note is removed or erased.

Now the problem is if anyone working on the drawing in Design state accidentally deletes this note, the program will not add back this note even when the sheet is updated. so the Create note works only once and it doesn't check after that. Is there any other workaround to this?

This functionality actually does saves some time and avoids mistakes of not removing the note before releasing.

Below is my program:

IF PTC_WM_LIFECYCLE_STATE:D=="Design"

SET STATE PRELIMINARY

ENDIF

[SYNDAKIT]

Manjunath,

     I believe that with the example you just explained, the drawing program is working as intended.

I'm not sure what you could do to prevent it from being deleted, but maybe this could be another way of dealing with it.

If you preform a move with the drawing program, the note will immovable until ptc_wm_lifecycle_state:D=="DESIGN" evaluates as false.

-thank you

[BenLoosli]

For my drawing program, I use layers that are turned on and off  with the various notes I want displayed. The notes are already created, just not visible when that state is not active.

I do notes and drawing symbols the same way. They are selected when a parameter is changed.

[nalexandru]

but his problem still remains: if someone deletes the note, it will remain deleted.

[manjunathrv]

That's right. This is the limitation currently Iam experiencing.

[nalexandru]

Hi, Ben,

But how are you managing those after that?

I mean, the drawing I'm working at has 144 layers and 109 states. Any advice how to manage such a monster?

And I have another one which is worse: almost 300 states.

How could I manage something like that? I mean, if I want to move a note or a dimension in a certain state, how could I do that?

Is it possible to replace a custom symbol with another?

Nic.

[dschenken]

"144 layers and 109 states"

I can't imagine why anyone would make a drawing like that. I think I am not alone in that belief.

You need to write up what was intended in order to get meaningful suggestions about what to do about it. Since that write-up wasn't given to you at the start it is going to be difficult; at least you didn't mention it.

Based on what I understand so far, I don't foresee a method to deal with this in a rational manner when this use of states is far outside the use case it was generated to solve. Why build a drawing that depicts so many deliverable options? This would publish at least 109 different versions of the drawing and maybe 2 to the 109th power versions without changing the drawing name or revision.

Anyway, I would like to better understand what the end result is and what the desired inputs are and what control scheme is desired (what you tell the person in charge of the drawing, not what they do after you tell them.) Basically, all the things that should have been told to you before you got this to work on.

[nalexandru]

well... it is an old template that needs to be updated. the assy is very simple: two cylinders of two different materials.

and the geometry varies with chamfers, holes (round and slots), grooves, things like that.

plus five different languages for the 2D drawing

plus different variations (a lot!!) for the finite product (aftermarket or no, with various degree of tolerances)

I attach the first page of the 109 states and the first set of layers visible on the menu (there others as I mentioned before) so you better understand what I am talking about. the 3D model has a lot of input parameters (hundreds)

My job is to change almost all the names of the parameters and update this monster of 2D template with the new custom symbols (a lot!! for every one there are five variants in the five different langages) and to work for the different dimensins of the bushings (diameter and length).

Is it possible to replace a custom symbol from a state with the one updated by me (new names, new standards, etc.)?

PS. seems like i can only update one image only... (I choose the view states)

[HamsterNL]

Have you considered dropping the drawing(s) and go for Model Based Definition (MBD)?

https://www.ptc.com/en/cad-software-blog/most-important-mbd-in-creo-4

Regarding the number of input parameters, our models use over 1200 input parameters. We use Excel to calculate/drive our models.

[HamsterNL]

And regarding the multiple languages, instead of using layers of notes, can't you use Excel to drive the text of the notes?

That will also make it a lot easier if you need to add a 6th language (dutch for example). You just add a new column to your Excel spreadsheet, translate all the text, and voila, your drawing now has dutch notes on it.

[nalexandru]

interesting. How exactly could i use excell for doing this?

It can be used in custom symbols also?

[HamsterNL]

In short, you create several INPUT parameters, for example

NOTE_001 STRING

NOTE_002 STRING

NOTE_003 STRING

NOTE_004 STRING

etc.

You can use those parameters as part of your dimenions, as a general note on your drawing, or as the Variable Text of a Custom Symbol. Use "&NOTE_001" (without the double quotes)

In Excel, you can create a table which holds all your notes, in all the different languages you want to use. Use INDEX and LOOKUP functions to 'select' the language and corresponding notes.

There's a bit of a downside, as the note can hold 80 characters at most. You thus have to check if you need to split a note with a lot of text in multiple input parameters.

[nalexandru]

INDEX and LOOKOUT are functions of Pro/E? I've never heard of them and I don't know how to use them. But the main problem is that the drawing uses custom symbols in more than 90% of the cases. So I don't know if you can store them in the excell file.

On the other hand, you have never used layers to manage the view states? It drives me crazy. if I have a view state, let's say ITALIAN, that shows me the italians notes and all the other languages are ticked as "blanked" layers, I would expect that the layers in the drawings to be hidden, including the PORTUGUESE.

Seems not the case in my drawing: see the capture I attach with the drawing layer on the left. PORTUGUESE visible, and view state definition layer on the right, PORTUGUESE ticked to be blanked.

I am confused...

[dschenken]

INDEX and LOOKUP are Excel functions. If the notes are dynamically replaced from Excel then those functions would be available.

I would probably use drawing overlays to manage the separate language versions. See http://support.ptc.com/help/creo/creo_pma/usascii/#page/detail%2FAbout_Using_Drawing_Overlays.html%23wwconnect_header

You are stuck with this method because someone took an idea that works on small cases and didn't consider how to maintain it. What's more, they didn't consider that PTC did not fully document how it functions, which should have been a hint that it's not a good feature to depend on.

Even the latest help is badly made and suggests:

The following table presents those commands that you can record (marked with an "X")

There no table in the help file. http://support.ptc.com/help/creo/creo_pma/usascii/#page/detail%2FThe_EDIT_STATE_Menu.html%23

Drawing Program looks like a half-done effort with stalled development. I would be looking at some other automation software to deal with this.

[nalexandru]

Well, you are right! I'm stuck with this solution because some one started like this. In Portuguese, buy the way. Which is not a disaster in itself but all the view states are named in portuguese.

Unfortunately i don't have the time to do everything again. i would have done it before, INCLUDING THE 3D MODEL which is to big for the fact that too many people "touched" it.

The model is in use at the moment so, unfortunately, my only option is to patch it...

I have a custom symbol that I cannot move, but it dissapear when i cahange the language. Is that meaning that it is attached to a view state? And the only way to move it is it by editing one of the view states where it is visible?

Is it better to use "Show/Erase" or layers or drawing overlays as you sugeste (and which I have never used it- so i should look into them a bit)?

Thank you again for your time,

Nic.

[nalexandru]

I really don't know what MBD is. I read the link you sent me but still I'm not sure what's about. And I don't understand your "dropping the drawing" statement what does it mean.

[HamsterNL]

MBD means that everything is stored in the 3D model. You don't have any drawings, as all annotations are stored with the 3D model.

Instead of opening a drawing, you would open the 3D model in a viewer, and you can show/hide the annotions in 3D.

We are a manufacturing firm, and we are very close to eliminate our last 2D drawings. Most steps/stages in our production can retrieve the information they need from the 3D model.

[nalexandru]

that's not the case here! we are creating 2D drawings on A2 orA1 with big fonts so the people on the shopfloor can easily read them on an A3 or A4 sheet!! so... no MBD in the next decades here, I suppose

how about the excell file that stores the different languages.

I attached an example: Let's say I have a note and I want to update it with a bigger font (so it could be read when printed on an A4!!!) and with the new names of the parameters which the drawing lost after I changed them (replaced them with ***). What's the approach to have it for my five languages?

[BenLoosli]

I as on vacation last week.

I guess I, and some others, need a beter explaination of what it is you are trying to accomplish. That is a large numkber of layers and states!

Mine is simple and a 1-1 relation between layers and states. I drive the state from a parameter, which then sets the state which turns on/off the proper layers. On each layer, we have symbols that get displayed. My use is relatively simple.

[nalexandru]

Hi, Ben

how do you manage the layers?

In my attached capture, I have a layer called "HEADER_HOUSING..." with 5 symbols in 5 different languages. One of them is not in the right position and I want to acces it to move it. Do you know how do i do that. And if , besides, moving, I want to replace it with a different version, do you know how could i do that?

Thank you,

nic.