PTC Parametric and direct modeling

[fdefilippi]

Greetings:

I was looking thru PTC website and one thing lead to another and I installed the direct modeling.  At first glance I was WOW!  nice UI, easy to use, compared to CREO parametric which I've been struggling with.   In a nut shell can some please tell me the difference between them  and some of the pros and cons.

thank you

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[dschenken]

As a long time parametric user I can say that parametric modeling is like creating a program that creates geometry, while direct modeling is more like filling in the results. Obviously this is very simplified. The pro of parametrics is that one can set up the model to produce predictable changes based on input changes and the program can be reviewed to see what factors were considered important. The con is that if the programming is done poorly or is unable to produce a desired change, the programming may need to be significantly reworked.

Direct modeling has no similar background. Changes are ad-hoc and can be unrelated to any prior concept of what the model is for. The pro is there is no program to go wrong, but the con is that there is no way to automatically have a design adapt in a pre-determined way.

[ThomasKirkman]

I work for a company that uses both Creo Parametric and Creo Elements/Direct Modeling.

Creo Parametric works well for families of parts.  As long as everyone that works on the parts builds the parts in a similar way.  We have issues when a part is built in a non standard way and a second person must edit that part.  They can spend several days just unraveling the history of how the part was built.

We use Creo elements/Direct Modeling in our machine design and R&D.  A part can be quickly modified without concern of how that part was built to begin with.

Prototyping and modification of prototypes is quick. 

Originally we used Parametric for Machine design and R&D, but the time to develop prototypes, modify them and get them to commercial state was out of scope for the market.

Each of these programs has its advantages based on what is being designed and how they are used.

Personally, I like direct because of its speed and ability to easily add lisp based utilities to it.

Regards

Tom

[fdefilippi]

Thank you Tom and Dave.

I'm a new user to Creo, and was looking through PTC's website, for some help, and came upon Creo Elements and download the free version.  I played around with it and found it very easy to model in simple blocks and features, very nice UI and intuitive to use.   Not to start a heated debate, but I'm the only ME at a new job for 3 months that used Creo / Pro-e and come from the Inventor/ SWX/ SolidEdge world and found Creo Elements to be similar in easy of use to past CAD systems I've used.  Though I was never really a big fan of SolidEdge.

A few question If I may ask:

If I was to switch from Creo Parametric to Creo Element what down fall should I expect?

Is the costs for both programs the same.

[ThomasKirkman]

That is a difficult one to answer. 

First, What type of design work do you do?  Are parts similar and repetitive?  Is each part unique?

Which version of Pro E does the company use?

You can directly load Pro E parts into Creo Elements/Direct Modeling and modify these parts.

You can also load Creo Elements/Direct Modeling parts into the newer Creo Parametric,  However, modifying these models is not easy.

Regards

Tom

[fdefilippi]

Q: First, What type of design work do you do?  Are parts similar and repetitive?  Is each part unique?

A: Metrology equipment for semi-con industry (optics, brackets, mounting plates).    some parts are standard not sure on percentage  I would take a stab at 50% are the same

Q: Which version of Pro E does the company use?

A: Creo 3.0

The reason I'm curious on Creo Elements, is I'm have a very difficult time understanding and learning Creo 3.0, w/o training being provided and no one to mentor me, and the work load is piling up and up.  With 25+ years of CAD experience, I've never used a program so difficult to use,  and Creo Elements looked like a promising alternative.

Thanks again

[ThomasKirkman]

First, is your company willing to let you get Creo elements/Direct Modeling?

Do you have access to any online training for Creo 3?  Have you checked out Youtube for training?

Creo Elements/Direct Modeling works with windchill as well.  Creo 3 can load Direct Modeling parts.

My personal opinion, if your company will let you get it, go for it.

Regards

Tom

[fdefilippi]

Hi Tom-

I'm not sure if my company is willing to pay for switching s/w we just paid for the Creo 3.0 subscription back in March.   I think my employer though that the person I replaced with years and years of experience in Creo/ Pro-E that the program is simple enough for SWX users to pick-up without any issues.   I believe they are realizing this is not the case, as productivity has dropped off.

I watch many youtube videos and post many questions, it does help some what.    Do you have a screen shot you could shoe me on a simple assembly of something you've done in Elements.

One more question, do you know what the cost is for Elements?

Thank you again

[ThomIvancso]

Seeing what your industry is that you are working in I can tell you that KLA Tencor which design semi conductor equipment uses both Creo Parametric (ProE) and Creo Elements Direct in their design environments.

So this may be something to bring to the table when you talk to your management about getting seats of Elements in house.

Regards,

Thom

[fdefilippi]

thank you Thom.

would you happen to know the cost of Elements.  I was digging more into Elements and I was surprised to hear it was a Co-Create product, back in 1998-1999 I was using that program

[ThomIvancso]

I do not know what the current price of Elements is it would be best to contact your PTC sales office to know your getting the right information.

And yes Creo Elements Direct Modeling was originally CoCreate SolidDesigner.

Regards,

Thom

[fdefilippi]

Thank you Thom-

I will contact my reseller.  I was under the assumption that SolidDesigner was rebranded to Creo Parametric 3.0  

I wonder how maintaining two different CAD programs will work out in the long run.  I would assume most would switch to Elements because of its ease of use.  Autodesk may still do this with Mechanical Desktop ( sucked ) and Inventor.  Eventually Inventor won out ( which is a nice program to use)

Thanks

[kdavidson]

there are use cases for both

Parametric is history based-Flexible modelling in Creo Parametric is direct modelling,

Direct is geometry based-it everything might as well be a step file