Can one enable the "Use original reference" to default when copying+pasting components?

[pausob]

1. Describe your environment: What is your industry? What is your role in your organization? Describe your stakeholders.
manufacturing engineering

machine design, fixture and jig design

2. What version of Creo Parametric are you currently running?
Creo 4 M150

3. Describe the problem you are trying to solve. Please include detailed documentation such as

screenshots, images or video.

in assembly mode, when using copy + paste special + advanced reference configuration to repeat the assembly of a component or group of components, the "Use original reference" checkbox is not checked and the reference collector is empty:

Has this behaviour changed at some point?  maybe I'm misremembering, but I swear before I didn't have to process the list of references (3 above, not a big deal, but gets quite tedious to keep checking on that box when that list is larger) 

4. What is the use case for your organization?
Using the copy+paste special+advanced configuration function made it simple to repeat the placement of components or patterns of components.

the repeat command is not as efficient as the new reference has to be selected; also - repeat doesn't work for groups/patterns...

Therefore, I'm asking if there is a config.pro option to make the "Use original reference" checkbox be on by default.

5. What business value would your suggestion represent for your organization?
efficiency

[MartinHanak]

Hi,

did you ask PTC Support ?

[sacquarone]

Hello @pausob 

I checked Pro/ENGINEER Wildfire 3.0 M250 (was releaed in July 201, 12 years ago) versus Creo Parametric 4.0 M150 (your version), and I do not see any difference of behavior (ISO functionality - No Regression). Behavior per default (recorded in the 2 attached movies in sessions started WITHOUT config.pro) is as follows:

• Use Original Reference unchecked
• But collector proposes per default what was the original reference used for the assembly constriant of originally copied component (allowing simple "Ok", without needing to "reselect" the wished reference)

Now, I can see that this collector seems to be empty per default in your snapshot. Related to that, is this reproducible in all assemblies when using this "Paste special" capability?

• If answer is "yes", my suggestion is to restart a new session without any config.pro (ideally without any toolkit as well):
  • If still reproducible like this, please open a case to us as suggested by @MartinHanak (no further ideas if so, sorry ...)
  • If not reproducible in standard, isolate option by dichotomy (if approach not clear, I can share an article later). Axis of investigation to isolate this option: one option containing scope in it (like default_scope_comp_setting option ?), preventing maybe usage of external references (on components, or skeletons, or assemblies, etc ...)
• if answer is "no" (means reproducible only for some assemblies, but not others), and persists EVEN without usage of any config.pro file, please also open a case to us and share data, in order to investigate what happens in the given impacted specific context.

Hope this helps at least for the next step of your investigations.

Regards,

Serge

[pausob]

Yes, tried it on another assembly, it works as in your video;  the original reference is in the collector, and the checkbox "use original reference" is unchecked...

Now that I think more about it, the check-box was never "on".  I also vaguely recall that my workflow stalled sometimes by the reference collector being empty, but didn't give it much thought before.  So sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.  I wonder if it's just for me?  I don't have time to investigate.

Also, I suggest that this checkbox is rather confusing - for it is not a "setting" that persists.  It functions more like a push-button that, when pressed, populates the collector with the original reference.  I think Creo is full of such GUI oddities.

@sacquarone , I don't have the means to submit a case to PTC, but I'm hoping you relay these concerns to the software development team.

And to be clear, there is no config.pro setting to control the state of the "use original reference" (so-called) checkbox ?

[sacquarone]

Hello @pausob 

Actually our internal process in PTC TS to contact R&D Team always starts from case and SPR references. On the other hand, before eventually considering contacting R&D Team, we always need to have a reproducible use case starting from a given expected context, and then reaching an unexpected outcome. A unique observation of something initially unexpected is not enough to initate an exchange in good conditions.

Regarding what you told us "So sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't". I investigated it a bit further. Please let me explain when and why it doesn't when this happens.

This occurs when using this Paste Special capability starting from a component whose placement constraints are external from the context where Paste Special is done. To access this information, I suggest using Reference Viewer and filtering items from Placement and External scope.

I illustrated what I tried to summarize above in little attached movie. I hope this will help to have a better understanding of when and why t occurs. In such situations, the missing information in collector is expected, because references cannot be accessed from the given context where references are missing.

Regards,

Serge

[sacquarone]

Hello @pausob 

Just for info, below a movie for a "more straight forward approch" to get an answer on the question "why this occurs when this occurs?" => Use RMB on reference displayed empty in collector, and access Information UI (better and quicker than cancelling the Paste Special attempt, and accessing Reference Viewer) => Illustrated in the new little movie, starting from originally empty sessions, and just retrieving the impacted context (SUB.ASM) where issue occurs.

Regards,

Serge

[pausob · Accepted solution]

Well, thanks for trying and providing this explanation.

I suppose it can explain my situation as the component being copied has references to a sub-component from an assembly.

The thing still not clear is that the system evidently knows these references - I just have to go through the list and click that checkbox and each is transferred into the collector.  I notice in your video that checkbox is gone so maybe it's some odd thing about Creo4 which is in the past anyway.

And I will assume that there is no config.pro setting about the checkbox being "pre-selected" as basically "use original reference" it is not a setting, but an action that is available depending on the context.