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relevant learnings from the PTC Live Global event.

nrollins
1-Newbie

relevant learnings from the PTC Live Global event.

Hi folks,



Other than the huge item we all are discussing regarding PTCUser. there are
a couple of things that I learned that we have discussed on here recently.



Creo 3.0 has a lot of decent changes that we will like - among which are:

you can specify 3 colors for draft check.

MMB to kill the measure tool

Those two really please me.



Another that I am excited with cautious optimism: they've reconstructed the
edit references tool to have a dashboard and added a handful of tools that -
in the DEMO - make it look much more helpful. We'll see.



Honestly, I have never been looking forward to an F000 build before, but I
am now. It seems like they have done a decent job and have addressed issues
and added functionality to make 3.0 much better. Again, we'll see.



I have never used Creo Direct or the Freestyle tool that comes in Creo
Parametric, but I saw demos on both and I am intrigued. The Freestyle
feature now is able to be tied to parametric geometry so one can control the
freestyle geometry to some extent.



RMB context menus are now configurable - in a very limited way, but the
promise was made that the freedom of customizing will grow in subsequent
releases. There are now icons in the RMB menus for redefine and reroute
making selection of those commands much easier and quicker. They have not
improved the ribbon scheme at all.



Dynamic interference check. I didn't see it really, only heard about it.



Smart fasteners - again, not sure how it works, but the demo showed a bolt
selected and positioned in the assy where it needed to go and the clearance
and threaded holes in the parts were created and washer assembled
automatically. I see that as not working as well in real life, but it could
be a time saver.



Chordal round was added (keep constant width.)



Ref Pattern does not req. the leader to be used.



Also,



We had a thread on here not too long ago about the (lack of a) materials
database inside Creo - I met a company in the Expo that offers just that -
materials database for Creo. He would not tell me what it cost, so you know
it isn't $50 - probably more like $5000 - who knows. But it might be of
interest to some - grantadesign.com



Back to work.



-Nate


This thread is inactive and closed by the PTC Community Management Team. If you would like to provide a reply and re-open this thread, please notify the moderator and reference the thread. You may also use "Start a topic" button to ask a new question. Please be sure to include what version of the PTC product you are using so another community member knowledgeable about your version may be able to assist.
33 REPLIES 33

Three color draft would have been worth the price of admission alonefor me. Finally I am glad they came to their senses!


On the other stuff.....


Why didn't just kill the measure tool altogether?


Dynamic Interference check in Assembly? That has been there for some time. Is it new functionality or just moved some place else within the suite?


As far as the "ooey, gooey" features likeDirect and Freestyle getting better, I will not hold my breath either. Functionalitylike that really does not resultin any "work" in the real world. For years there was always talk and mis-fires regarding the "easy modification features" like those and it never really amounted to anything useful. Sure you can pull geometry around like taffy, but what is the point? I guess if I were in the marsmallow engineering business it might make sense....other than that...harumph!


Edit references....hmmmm...what can I say other than each time I inadvertently click that worthless PITA buttonbecause is sits right next to the ultra useful Edit Definition button...I silently curse the programmer that obviously did not work for a living on Pro that placed it where it was. Personally...I never use Edit References.


As far as mouse buttons and their functions....I already have carpal tunnel from all the mouse clicks it takes now. I get all warm and fuzzy thinking about the clicking future.


How about smart Holes? We still have to use the L-I-M-I-T-E-D canned offering within the hole tool. Smart Fasteners sounds neat....


Don't mean to sound like a whiner....but when you have been around the PTC block as many years as I have, it just doesn't inspire any longer.


What about Creo for a tablet?


What about fixing the nightmare of multiple config files?


I have to run to a meeting.....the list could go on and on......

Dean,

If you've never used "edit references" (or reroute as it was once called), you're missing out on one of the most powerful tools in Proe for maintaining design intent. One that I sorely miss whenever I have to use SolidWorks.

Nightmare of multiple config files? I'm sure you meant the power of multiple config files. Being able to load multiple configs mean I can lock down some options in one (config.sup), create a company wide starting point in another (company config.pro), load my client's prefs in a third (client config.pro) and allow my users to control their own options in a 4th (user congif.pro). Another thing I miss in SW, I have only control on how that install was initially set up, period. If I want to change things for all, I need to touch every machine, logged in as each user.

--
--
Doug Schaefer | Experienced Mechanical Design Engineer
LinkedIn
mlocascio
4-Participant
(To:nrollins)

Doug and Dudes,



I just finished a Solid Works trial version a couple of weeks ago. The Solid
Works guy emailed me today and I told him where I stood. In my evaluation I
did not find anything worth switching to Solid Works for. Personally I think
that there is too much wasted time ADDING DIMENSIONS on drawings. They
missed the boat COMPLETELY.



It's always good to know things about other CAD systems.



Michael P. Locascio


Doug,


It's not that I don't understand Edit Refs, I simply can Edit Definition faster and with more confidence that when the model regens I still have a good model. You say po-tay-to, I sat po-tah-to...we still love spuds!


Yes, for me...config.sup, config.pro, current-config.pro, friday-config.pro just gets crazy. Maybe more to the point is the over-ride of the one that went active when pro was launched and then not having active, then not really knowing where the "active' one is, or saved or.....!!!!! I am just a CAD monkey.....I don't want to track all that Crapola. I know the AdminMonkies need it....so I know I am just whining. ;o)

mlocascio
4-Participant
(To:nrollins)

CAD Monkeys UNITE!




llie
15-Moonstone
(To:nrollins)

Could someone please point me to the webpage where I can upload my presentation I do at PTC Live Global?

We have the wrong PDF's uploaded for our presentation.

Thank you,
Lance Lie

The problem I have with Edit Refs, and other edit/redefine features at least in CE/P WF5, is the lack of specific, helpful feedback.

I can go to edit references | missing references. The prompt will come back with a generic dialog like 'select datum plane, face, etc... but I get no visual indication from the software what/where the old reference was located.
My only recourse is to try to open another session of the software, reload an older model if I can find one, and roll back to find what the expected references are.

This is where competing CAD softwares really shine.


Christopher F. Gosnell

FPD Company
124 Hidden Valley Road
McMurray, PA 15317

Ahh, Chris,



This has been addressed - every model saves a "ghost" image of every
reference (at the expense of file size) for just this purpose. The
reference ghost (my term) is a config option - in the demo it was very clear
and seemed to work very well.



I personally cannot imagine running Creo without "reroute" - Without it,
Solidworks would really be a formidable competitor. Not using Edit Refs
only happens because one never took the time to learn it. I miss it every
time I need to use SWX. Dean, you should give it another college try.



-Nate


mlocascio
4-Participant
(To:nrollins)

Yes, another case for training..


mlocascio
4-Participant
(To:nrollins)

WAIT A MINUTE! HOLD THE PHONE! There has to be a reference (in color) of
what you are trying to replace. That's the way that Pro/E has handled even
before we had this menu driven UI.



Michael P. Locascio


RandyJones
19-Tanzanite
(To:nrollins)

On 06/19/14 14:23, Chris Gosnell wrote:
>
> The problem I have with Edit Refs, and other edit/redefine features at least in CE/P WF5, is the
> lack of specific, helpful feedback.
>
> I can go to edit references | missing references. The prompt will come back with a generic dialog
> like 'select datum plane, face, etc... but I get no visual indication from the software what/where
> the old reference was located.
>

New in Creo Parametric 3.0 is an image of the old reference:

> a CAD monkey.....I don't want to track all that Crapola. I know the AdminMonkies need it....so I
>...



















No, I have the same complaint about failed references not showing up when
trying to use reroute. Makes reroute of failed features almost useless
(unless you open an old model to see what went missing as Chris
mentioned). This is when you go into 'edit definition' and then you get
to see the original curves even though the references are missing.


Doug Barton
Senior Mechanical Designer
Parker Hannifin Canada
Electronic Controls Division
1305 Clarence Avenue
Winnipeg, MB R3T 1T4 Canada
direct 204 453 3339 x309
fax 204 452 7156
-
www.parker.com/ecd




This is on WF4.0


Doug Barton
Senior Mechanical Designer
Parker Hannifin Canada
Electronic Controls Division
1305 Clarence Avenue
Winnipeg, MB R3T 1T4 Canada
direct 204 453 3339 x309
fax 204 452 7156
-
www.parker.com/ecd


----- Forwarded by Doug Barton/ECD/HYD/PARKER on 06-19-2014 03:49 PM -----

Yes - in Failure Resolve Mode>investigate backup model> roll to failure >
reroute, the refs would be colored and highlighted. But they still existed
in the backup model so they could be displayed. This functionality can
still be used in Creo2 if you turn it on. In CR3 the missing refs will
still have their ghost to tell us where they were from in the failed model.




I really miss FRM - but I am hopeful that this is even better.


But if you know your model and know what is missing, reroute lets you FLY
through a failure - much quicker than Edit Definition. I tend to try edit
refs first and if I get lost, I resort to Edit Def. I find my hit rate
makes that extra effort pay off overall. Certainly less success if it is not
your model or legacy work.



Nate




Just cannot seem to find the presentations from the event. Any suggestions in locating them would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Patrick Fariello
CommScope
1300 E. Lookout Dr. Suite 150
Richardson, TX 75082
phone: 972-792-3303
-<blocked::<a style="COLOR:" blue;=" text-decoration:=" underline&quot;=" target="_BLANK" href="mailto:-">">mailto:->


________________________________

I like the other feature of edit refs - when a large number of features refers to an item all those references can be changed.


For example, if a number of features uses a default datum plane, but the model needs them to move, one can reroute all the references -to- the default datum plane and convert them to refer to a different datum plane, one that is separate, without going into each of the items and making that change.


This is really handy in large assemblies when large numbers of components refer to one part which a different part is replacing.


x

Yes, yes....I know.....never say never. David/Doug/Nate, for that type of situation I do use Edit Refs. But those are, I believe, statistically low occurances relative to everyday use....at least in my world.The situation I see many get themselves into is modeling and/or assembling things without the manufacturing process or assembly order in mind. It's in these scenarios, when sloppymodeling or assembly methods are used,that tools like edit refs become handy.Now I know not every person, every day with every model finds themselves in ths pickle or models things badly. I am not intending to flame anyone....but it does happen. And...I am glad we have these redundant and overlapping functionality tools to deal with it.


The most common catalyst for this that I see is setting datum reference frames after the fact. Many times it's not possible to predict how manufacturing will want to inspect the product. Also, many times features/parts will change or be removed that had the datum tagged to it andthat is whenedit refs will shone. This is a double edged sword. Edge 1 is setting datums first and modeling to those or edge 2, add them later and hope you assumptions were close to correct. But also, in many of these scenarios,Edit definition.works just as well IMHO.

I've gotten burned badly in the past by modelling using starting GD&T A-B-C datum references for inspection. I always place my inspection GD&T datum preferences as far down the model tree as I can now.

Christopher F. Gosnell

FPD Company
124 Hidden Valley Road
McMurray, PA 15317

If CREO3 still shows ghosts of missing refs during reroute that is almost enough of a reason to jump over upgrading to CREO2 right to CREO3. Thanks for the info.

Christopher F. Gosnell

FPD Company
124 Hidden Valley Road
McMurray, PA 15317

What is that config option? I'd really like to turn this on, especially when the references are damaged, or missing.

Christopher F. Gosnell

FPD Company
124 Hidden Valley Road
McMurray, PA 15317

Chris,


If memory serves....I think it's ref_scope_something. I could be way off.

If he gave it to us, I did not write it down. But it is on by default. I
wonder if it is a hidden option in CR2.?






bkurth
7-Bedrock
(To:nrollins)

Another one I found out about, was a config option that will allow the Measure Tool to open with the window expanded. This is another part of the Measure Tool that is frustrating.




In Reply to Nathan Rollins:


Hi folks,



Other than the huge item we all are discussing regarding PTCUser. there are
a couple of things that I learned that we have discussed on here recently.



Creo 3.0 has a lot of decent changes that we will like - among which are:

you can specify 3 colors for draft check.

MMB to kill the measure tool

Those two really please me.



Another that I am excited with cautious optimism: they've reconstructed the
edit references tool to have a dashboard and added a handful of tools that -
in the DEMO - make it look much more helpful. We'll see.



Honestly, I have never been looking forward to an F000 build before, but I
am now. It seems like they have done a decent job and have addressed issues
and added functionality to make 3.0 much better. Again, we'll see.



I have never used Creo Direct or the Freestyle tool that comes in Creo
Parametric, but I saw demos on both and I am intrigued. The Freestyle
feature now is able to be tied to parametric geometry so one can control the
freestyle geometry to some extent.



RMB context menus are now configurable - in a very limited way, but the
promise was made that the freedom of customizing will grow in subsequent
releases. There are now icons in the RMB menus for redefine and reroute
making selection of those commands much easier and quicker. They have not
improved the ribbon scheme at all.



Dynamic interference check. I didn't see it really, only heard about it.



Smart fasteners - again, not sure how it works, but the demo showed a bolt
selected and positioned in the assy where it needed to go and the clearance
and threaded holes in the parts were created and washer assembled
automatically. I see that as not working as well in real life, but it could
be a time saver.



Chordal round was added (keep constant width.)



Ref Pattern does not req. the leader to be used.



Also,



We had a thread on here not too long ago about the (lack of a) materials
database inside Creo - I met a company in the Expo that offers just that -
materials database for Creo. He would not tell me what it cost, so you know
it isn't $50 - probably more like $5000 - who knows. But it might be of
interest to some - grantadesign.com



Back to work.



-Nate

cying
8-Gravel
(To:nrollins)

Chris, I think these three params are what you are looking for.

cleanup_drawing_dependencies yes_cs_not_required
cleanup_layout_dependencies yes_cs_not_required
dm_hide_model_dummy_deps yes


[cid:image001.png@01CF8C66.43FE8420]

Once you are done cleaning up, comment them out or change the value to NO. Per PTC, you do not want to leave them in your config set to yes as default.

NOTE: DO NOT ENABLE THE CLEANUP OPTIONS BY DEFAULT
* Many dependencies which initially appear as ghost objects or default references may be valid and should not be removed. If the cleanup options are applied indiscriminately, it is possible to remove dependencies which were used in the drawing or layout (For example: After cleanup of a valid depedendency, a drawing cosmetic reference may have asterisks "***" in place of the value(s), or an external reference parameter may not update correctly when the layout parameter is changed.).
* Enable the options when attempting to cleanup specific drawings or layouts
* Retrieval performance is significantly decreased when the cleanup options are enabled as Pro/ENGINEER or Creo Parametric will automatically search the Commonspace for each missing object during retrieval

Good Luck!

Calvin

Yes - along with that, the old replace workflow - where you pick one entity
to measure from and the second pick gets replaced automatically by
subsequent picks.



measure_dialog_expand (y/n)

measure_auto_replace (y/n)



and even better:



measure_ref_option (cannot read my writing.)

This one remembers your selection of "use as axis" or "use as plane"



And I have not tried it, but I think he said this will work in the current
Creo2 build (m100+). Someone try it please and report in! I am not able to
right now. (too bad there's not a "close_measure_with_mmb")



-Nate


Creo 2, M110
measure_dialog_expand works nicely.
KenL.Nunn
4-Participant
(To:nrollins)

Both work in C2 M100

measure_dialog_expand (y/n)

measure_auto_replace (y/n)

Very helpful.



Ken L. Nunn, Technical Director. +61 427-454-511


This is a PERFECT example of the exploder working so well!!

I didn't know I even wanted these setting in our config files... just tested them and now I will implement. Improvement made in our workflow without much effort at all!

PS - NEVER WOULD HAVE FOUND THESE IN A FORUM... Because I wouldn't have been searching for something I didn't know existed! It was hand deliveried (via e-mail) on a plater.

Michael Ohlrich, Design Engineer
Benchmade Knife Company
mohlrich@benchmade.com<">mailto:mohlrich@benchmade.com>
(503) 655-6004 x122

[cid:image002.jpg@01CF8C6C.84A20140]
www.benchmade.com<">http://www.benchmade.com>

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail communication and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged information for the use of the designated recipients. If you are not the intended recipient, (or authorized to receive for the recipient) you are hereby notified that you have received this communication in error and that any review, disclosure, dissemination, distribution or copying of it or its contents is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please destroy all copies of this communication and any attachments and contact the sender by reply e-mail or telephone (503) 655-6004).
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