Once again, I am battling Creo to do the simplest things anyone can do on a computer. I don't get it—did Creo developers make it a point to make simple tasks as complicated and counterintuitive as they could imagine?
All I need to do: to save an assembly file in a different folder. When I select Save As, a window opens for saving a file—but it doesn't let me save the file! I have no idea why this window even opens up. I can do complex tasks in every other program, except for Creo it seems, which saps me of patience and time for the simplest tasks anyone can possibly imagine.
Not a buyer, Creo. Not a buyer.
Update: Apparently, Creo doesn't like it when I try to save a file with the same name but in a different folder. "Save As" works as expected if I change the file name, but apparently Creo developers assumed that no one would ever want to save a file with the same name but in a different folder.
Why, that would just be of no use to anyone, I suppose. I would love to look at their design documents.
That's because the surest way to make everyone miserable is to have multiple objects with the same name. Which one is the right one?
One project I was on had people making copies everywhere; like there were 12 copies of the same assembly in different folders and each person could be working on their own version, but come time to put them into the next level of assembly, which one is the 'right' one? Many of them were just making 'temp' versions to check things out and were in folders named 'temp_something' or 'test_something', but not all of them. And the latest version or the most recent version weren't necessarily the 'right' version. Oh, what a mess.
If you need a copy in another folder, Windows does that and does it well.
If you need to make a backup to save a version in case things go badly, Creo has Backup.
David—the appropriate file name is for you and your team to determine. If naming different versions of the same file is a problem, you can establish a process whereby members in your team use different names. No need for software to impose its assumptions of what is proper on everybody—especially when those assumptions are not right all the time.
I tell you, I have rarely been this frustrated at software. Usability matters too. I am okay with spending an hour figuring out how to do something complex. But spending an hour figuring out how do simple things like saving a file, just because PTC devel thought it was cute to reinvent the wheel and completely change how "Save As" works?
No, thanks. Whatever advantages such features might have, they don't trump the costs—namely the lower usability of the software.
Why not dedicate devel resources toward tangibly improving what the software does instead of taking simple features that work well and make them so complex that suddenly one needs a course to use them again?
...and the problem you describe, David, is solved by using version-control software like Perforce—something I imagine PTC developers would be familiar with because most developers use such software. I think that PTC is imposing a bad version of "Save As" on its users under the wrong assumptions.
As a user, I want the ability to save a file under the name of my choosing, in the location of my choosing, as painlessly and quickly as possible. And that includes saving a file with the same name but elsewhere. I do it all the time and it works great. We use version-control software to ensure that the latest good version of a file is in a stable directory that everyone else can access to check out the file.
No need for such features.
PTC is more about maintaining a consistency and the backup function has been there since day one from decades ago. I can open Pro|E 18 files in Creo 2.0 and it is the same as the day I left it there.
Maybe Creo is not for you. But I am glad that what I learned back in the 90's is still relevant today. This might be the -only- software I can say that about these days. Maybe it is a bit cultish for me to feel to this way, but there it is.
save as backup" in a different folder without changing name" is very much there in creo . and i have been doing that for years now...did i miss something?
Look. People might well want to save a file in a different folder while using the same name *without* intending the new file to be a backup. It's a usability issue is all. I can save files in a blink of an eye, using any name I want, in any folder I want, in any other application. In SolidWorks, Adobe Illustrator, Photoshop, MATLAB, you name it.
But you come to Creo, and suddendly it's a science. You can save a file in a different folder using "Save As", but not with the same name. Or, it seems, you can use some "save as backup" option to save the file elsewhere using the same name—though if your motive is not to create a backup file, then you are likely to not even notice that option.
I would rather stare at the blinding sun for 60 seconds than have to use Creo on a daily basis for work. I don't care how long these misguided options have been around—they are still misguided.
PTC put a method in place to prevent problems and you look to work around it; a work around that is as simple as using the operating system to copy and paste. Unlike other software you have used, Creo allows users to make complex systems and encouraging users in bad behavior is counterproductive.
I think you are special in your needs. I see no other users asking for the Save As function to work as you like. That includes the PTCuser board, which goes back before 2000.
What might also interest you is that when you do a Save As, it doesn't switch the context to the new place, but continues to work on the old ones and when you perform a Backup it does switch to the new context.
Thanks for explaining version control software and file naming. It reminds me of when I started in CAD. And, how only 10 years after that when PTC was incorporated and started selling Pro/Engineer. I might still have some of the ads in the old Machine Design magazines from rev 4 or 5 that I kept from when it was first widely marketed.