cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Highlighted
Amethyst

PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

ptcreo 4.0_1.JPG

ptcreo 4.0_2.JPG

17 REPLIES 17
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

So with all the feedback to improve the drawing features of Creo from the users, they are going to move more towards models with 3D annotations.  

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

We've been asking for drawing features to be improved for 15 years.  PTC has been convinced that drawings have no future for that long too, yet here we are, still fumbling to create drawings.

What if they had invested half of the money they've invested in MBD into streamlining drawing creation?

--
Doug Schaefer | Experienced Mechanical Design Engineer
LinkedIn
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

I have never understood how eliminating drawings actually eliminates work??!!!?? Everything you do in the drawing has to be done on the model, you have to take care to check your tolerances and your GD&T. You have to make sure you are dimension from the functional features. You have to provide surface finishes and notes. You have to make sure everything is in the proper annotation plane for viewing.

Now it is on a viewer instead of on paper. You have to interrogate the model to get the information you need. Its no where near as easy to mark it up or mark it to ask a question. It's less accessible. Its no where near as organized in the model as it is on a drawing.

I was fooled many many years ago about how easy it was to make your model and simply show your dimensions and abracadabra, you have a complete drawing. I'm not fooled about how easy it will be to fully document a part, in the model..

I don't believe it for a second.


Steve Williams
Pro/E Version 15/16 (Circa 1995/1996)
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Here is a link to a poll I put up to get a feel for how drawings are being used at companies today:

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

The article is here:

What’s in PTC Creo 4.0? A Sneak Sneak Peek! | PTC

This quote is interesting:

... a 3D model, if annotated correctly, can provide all that information and more; it’s also easier to distribute and share within your organization.

The key phrase there is "within your organization".  If you've got PTC products from top to bottom, a properly notated 3D file can be shared from design to engineering to management to manufacturing.  How many organizations are that vertically integrated?  Most have to share data outside with any number of small or large vendors who have everything from Creo to SW to Inventor to AutoCAD to no in house CAD at all.  A drawing, converted to PDF, can be shared with anyone with a PC.

I'd also contend that "a 3D model, if annotated correctly" takes a similar amount of additional effort as a decent drawing should, assuming we get decent drawing tools.

A 3D annotated files require additional training and additional software to view.  Plus, all the info is going to be on various annotation planes, meaning I need to rotate the model to see everything.  With a drawing, it's all in one plane.

I can also print a drawing and take it out to the shop floor, right next to the machine and review a trouble spot.  With a 3D model, I need a PC at the machine with the right software or a portable tablet in order to do so.

I get that drawing-less manufacturing is sexy and easier drawings isn't.  But drawings are still much more universal and much, much easier to use and distribute.

--
Doug Schaefer | Experienced Mechanical Design Engineer
LinkedIn
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

LOL, I guess the forum software doesn't like "secksy".

--
Doug Schaefer | Experienced Mechanical Design Engineer
LinkedIn
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

AMEN BROTHER!!! I just posted almost the same thing!!!


Steve Williams
Pro/E Version 15/16 (Circa 1995/1996)
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

I tried to leave the same as a comment on the actual post, but either the comment form is broken or I ran afoul of the content police.

--
Doug Schaefer | Experienced Mechanical Design Engineer
LinkedIn
Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Good day everyone,

It has come to our attention the blog comments process on PTC.com is not working in the most customer-centric of ways & thank you Doug Schaefer‌ for the information.

For anti-SPAM reasons, comments go into an approval queue, but there was no notification of this.  The system is being repaired and I will provide an update when I have it.

Toby

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

While I think its a blunder on PTC side with drawings; argue the fact that if I  need a rapid prototype for proof of concept, then why do I need a drawing?  However, that all changes once I need a tolerance.

With that I don't need to get on my soapbox to explain the importance of a detail drawing to everyone here, it boils down to the fact is a drawing is a contract with a shop they have to make it according to the drawing, if they don't they eat the cost.

With every shop I give them detail drawing in PDF, and if they request a stp file for their cnc programming.  But I will never ever take it upon myself to just give a 3d model unless I need a rapid prototype or instructed by management

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

We started using Parametric when Creo 1.0 first came out. At that time we were told that the 2D portion of Parametric would become its own app at a future release.  Haven't heard anymore about that since.

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

That's the future through the past. The original Pro/E had a separate module called Pro/Detail.

The thing about saving time by not making drawings is interesting. There is still effort required to put all the relevant information into the CAD system, no matter the details about the storage and retrieval method. It seems like the main limitation for MBE is getting the equipment, software, and training in place to use it.

The biggest limitation to using MBE is that there has been no good place for downstream users to make easy annotations. By the way, for those who think otherwise, an annotation is something added to a completed work. So adding notes and symbols to a CAD model is not annotation; it is necessary to complete the description.

Annotation is adding a note to a finished/standalone work and not putting it in to begin with. Dimensions? Not annotation. Model notes? Not annotation. Redline change - that is annotation.

In either case, whether a PDF or a printed page, the tools required for annotation are cheap and effective. And distribution of the annotated drawings is cheap and well defined. Screen-grab + e-mail, for example.

In highly vertical industries MBE may work fine, but it can't replace all 2D distribution of documentation in the remaining 95% of industry. Also of note - computer monitors are all 2D, even if they are used to display a '3D' model. Still waiting on Hololens, Oculus Rift, and related 3D interactivity in the CAD applications.

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

when ever PTC is excited about a Pro|E/Creo release like this time...I am more worried.

So this time may be we have to Hold "ctrl+alt+shift" and RMB+MMB to place a dimension in drawing.

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Im afraid that trying to make drawings obsolete is like trying to make books obsolete...wont work.

There is practicality tied with using drawings. There are wonderfull things/inventions out there that will never take off in real life because they are simply not practical. They should have just fixed drawings in Creo but I guess removing what makes problems makes sense-kinda. My cars motor is broken...oh well ill just throw it out of car and walk problem solved.

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

sigh. I know no one from PTC actually visits these forums, where do they get these ideas? I don't get it. So many broken tools in the packages now.

How about Creo4 "We decided to fix patterns this time." that would sell more copies.

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Hi Matt,

I understand your comment: responding to Ideas has not been our best quality.

I am in the Community every day: reading & responding - I am your advocate.  I cannot promise an immediate change to our procedures; PTC is a very big ship, but I am here to listen and work on your behalf. 

Best,

Toby

Highlighted

Re: PTC Creo 4.0..eagerly waiting for you!

Thank you Toby.  I think we all appreciate that.

Announcements
Business Continuity with Creo: Learn more about it here.