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Praveen_11149112-Amethyst
12-Amethyst
August 1, 2014
Solved

External simplified Rep

  • August 1, 2014
  • 4 replies
  • 6037 views

Hi,

I am trying to add the component in the external simplified rep but the added component is not getting updated/visible in the reference assembly.

I am just trying to check if concurrent modeling is possible with external simplified rep.

It will be of great help if any one can solve this problem

Best answer by gkoch

Hello Praveen,

Only benefit from ESR is to create a separate assembly file?

As Moshe wrote earlier in the thread, there are two main benefits:

  1. Use a separate file for the simplified rep - the huge benefit is that everybody can create such an External Simplified Rep when needed without modifying the actual assembly (and checking in again, requiring all others to update, etc...)
  2. Plus ESR allows to add components that should not appear in the assembly - this allows for example to show models, your design would interact with in reality or devices that are used for assembling your design

If we need to work on sub assembly level then what is the use of ESR ?

  • If you have everything you need in your subassembly, open the subassembly, work on it and don't mind top assembly simplified reps. However, if you are in the situation (like many users), that you need to see your subassembly in the context of a (huge) top assembly, you will need simplified reps - external or internal. Externals offer just above mentioned additional benefits.
    For example: If you do the cabling, you normally have a subassembly for it, but how would you design the cables without knowing the full assembly?

They have mentioned that multiple users can work simultaneously and I am not able to understand How??

  • This should be clear by now: If you design a large assembly with multiple sub-structures (e.g. engine, suspension, chassis, electric, fuel system, exhaust pipes...) and if you have build your assembly clever enough to use sub-assemblies corresponding to the sub-structures, multiple persons can work on different sub-assemblies or parts simultaneously.
  • ESR does not empower multiple persons to change the same model simultaneously. It allows them to work on different components, while being in the context of the same top-assembly.
  • To allow multiple persons to work on the same model, you can use the Update and Integrate functionality, mentioned by Christopher. It basically allows to merge two different design iterations (new versions created by two different users), which both have originated from the same model. So both users work on the model separately and later someone has to do the cleanup and align the designs. If more than two users change the model, it requires multiple merges. But this has nothing to do with ESR.

4 replies

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TomD.inPDX17-Peridot
17-Peridot
August 1, 2014

I am not sure I understand your process. Are you trying to substitute a component in an assembly with another family table member of one of the components? For this, you can use "replace" in the model tree. Be sure all the mating references are available in each family table member.

If this is not what you are trying to achieve, please feel free to post some images and a little more detail on the process and where it fails.

Welcome to the forum. Praveen.

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Praveen_11149112-AmethystAuthor
12-Amethyst
August 7, 2014

Sorry for late reply.

I am interested to know if it is possible for multiple engineers to work simultaneously on the large assembly.

Assume each engineer creating the seperate external simp rep and works on it independently and finally checks into the common space then will the changes made ( like component added or change in constrain type) in external simplified rep gets reflected or updated in main/ reference assembly.

Please see the attached document for better understanding.

I am also not sure if this is the intended use of the external simplified rep

image_1.png

image_2.png

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TomD.inPDX17-Peridot
17-Peridot
August 7, 2014

I am sorry but the term "external" simplified rep is not specifically familiar to me in the 1st place. I use simplified reps for specific display states. I will have to look into this further.

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MosheBaum1-Visitor
1-Visitor
August 8, 2014

ESRs (External Simplified Reps) are designed for two main purposes:

1. Allow better collaboration in Large Assebmly scenarios.

Users can define a reduced scope of the assembly (just like internal simprep), but instead of providing access to entire top assembly, or keepign simprep definition of each such reduced scope in the top assembly - you can store that definition in a separate file - the ESR - which will point to only to the objects (and level of details) defined to be included and accessible in this scope.

That allows you to distribute different contexts of work to different users ion the team, w/o forcing them to download entire top assmebly, but only the items requireed for their design task. Also - in complex projects with complex IP-related restrictions - it can come handy if, say, external providers need to design some components in the system - they can get a filtered-down ESR that exposes only relevant information yet allow them still to collaborate and feed their designs into the top context.

In addition - you can define/edit its content quickly and efficiently directly from Windchill (10.0+) using the embeddd Creo View visualization and filter down the scope as needed.

In order to make changes that will reflect in the top assembly as well - user must at least have access to shared items he'd like to modify. Im the sample above - the bolts should have been added whuile activating e.g. sub-assembly that is inherited in the ESR from the original top assembly, instead of directly in the ESR itself.

Which leads to next bullet >>>

2. Allow design add-on items that are NOT meant to be included into the original top assembly

One can add additional objects in the context of the ESR directly, outside of the shared scope, w/o making any impact to the top assembly. Like - manufacturing jigs and fixtures. Or maybe a new add-in product that is meant to be assembled to the original one, but not inherent part of its BOM. E.g. a side-storgae for motorcycle: ESR would contain rear portion of the bike, maybe some fairings pieces, etc. - in the area where the box needs to fit on. But this box may not be considered a piece of the original bike but rather and aftermarket item... So it can be designed in a reduced scope ESR, that will load much faster, and not include any unneeded details like the engine internals or so.

Hope that clarifies.

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23-Emerald IV
TomU23-Emerald IV
23-Emerald IV
August 8, 2014

Would it be fair to say that the ESR is nothing more than a "save a copy" of the top level assembly with some stuff removed?

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MosheBaum1-Visitor
1-Visitor
August 8, 2014

No

ESR *shares* same content with the top assembly for the items that are included thus saves the hassled of duplication (not to mention redundant objects to manage).

ESR is the only way to actualy have a shared dependent selective/partial content w/o having to share entire assembly, and still reflect updates done concurrently in both contexts.

C
ChristopherLewi12-Amethyst
12-Amethyst
August 8, 2014

A lot of chat on your question but i think your key line was "I am just trying to check if concurrent modeling is possible with external simplified rep.". Your point being that two users could add simultaneously to a single assembly file. I assume you conclude that without PDM integration workflow this would not be possible now.

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23-Emerald IV
TomU23-Emerald IV
23-Emerald IV
August 8, 2014

Based on what's been described, the answer is no. You can add to subassemblies that are inside the top level assembly, but you can't add to the top level assembly itself.

I don't think this is a limitation of the PDM system but rather that two people can't both work on the exact same file. Fundamentally you are trying to have two people modify the actual top level assembly. That's not happening (unless I'm completely misunderstanding this).

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ChristopherLewi12-Amethyst
12-Amethyst
August 8, 2014

Tom,

You can use Windchill/Creo Update and Integrate functionality to keep multiple sets of changes. Thus you can sort of work on the same file at the same time if you're organized.

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    ptc-48646031-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    December 1, 2014

    one question: if I am working on an assy that I DO NOT want to check out BUT I want to control the assy's SimReps for visual purposes while working on sub assy components.

    I keep loosing my rep states since the main assy is not checked out.

    can I use an ESR of the main assy to save those states?

    C
    ChristopherLewi12-Amethyst
    12-Amethyst
    December 1, 2014

    External Simplified Rep is a way to do this.

    Also making your own 'master viewing assembly' is a reasonable option i.e. make a new fake assy that you assemble the assembly you want to persist simplified reps across your working sessions into as the component. Provided you don't build any external references in that assy, you'll not have to check it in.

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    ptc-48646031-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    December 1, 2014

    i was doing the dummy assy technique for awhile but was hoping that ESR's is a safer way.

    thank you for the reply.

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