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BG_986910414-Alexandrite
14-Alexandrite
August 26, 2022
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Level/stage of completion prt/drw Blank part->Machined part->Ground part->Coated part

  • August 26, 2022
  • 2 replies
  • 2374 views

Level/stage of completion prt/drw Blank part->Machined part->Ground part->Coated part

CREO 7.0.3.0

Hello,

 

The point:

What options are there? Is there a better/"best" way? Is Creo good enough in this area or would some changes make it easier?

 

My area of struggle:

example I make a 4 level of completion part set with each merged into the next. I want to make a similar product, Usually I would do a save as copy and CREO+Windchill grabs the drw and make a copy of that part and drw with the new name. Problem with the level of completion part set is the save as copy has no way to save all 4 levels into a new independent set(I would not expect it to). I have to export all 4 levels of prt/drw to my local machine, disconnect Windchill rename all the prt/drws in a session, reconnect windchill, upload the new parts set and drws. I want/wish/dream to streamline saving a level of completion part set as a copy. Sometimes I do the offline rename sometimes I run my mapkeys through the program 4x to make the parts from scratch.

There is a rare case I do want to use save as copy when a new finished version can be made from the same old blank part, it maybe the common case for others.

 

My history with the process:

For years now and with multiple companies I have worked with models that had levels of completion and drawings at each level. Old job/s only did 2 levels max and only multiple levels in the case of a cast/forged part. That was nice. Casting or forging drawing and a drawing speccing the finished state of the part letting the supplier do as they wish to get there. New work likes to get in there and micro manage with Blank part->Machined part->Heat treat->Abrasive flow machined part->Ground part->Superfinish part->Coated. Those are examples, some are 1 level some many and everywhere in between.

 

How I have done it:

Old work it was done at the corporate level with special start part/mapkey setup that copied in the 2levels and renamed with new part numbers for the parts. To me it looked like blank part was merged into the finished part as the first model tree feature. Had to click on the External Merge feature and "Open Base Model" to edit the blank part. I asked how it was done and drafter showed me the process(pre-creo) that was used.

The steps:

1. Make blank part file
2. Make empty part file for the next level of completion

3. Open new empty ASM file (will not be saving this ASM)

4. ASM the empty part file for the next level of completion in the ASM file, cso to asm acso

5. ASM the blank part in the ASM file, Part CSO to PART CSO

6. Boolean operation(old name was different) merge the blank in to the part.(there are some check boxes to check and uncheck in creo...details)

7. Save the new level of completion part

8. Cleanup, close asm and erase it.

 

The process is the same at my work now. The process is specific to not end up with a dependency to the ASM file. I made a mapkey that does most of the work but, still have to pause for several selections. 

What my research has shown:

Get data>Merge: The merge part of this I think results in the same or similar outcome as the ASM method of merge but with much fewer clicks. The downside is I cannot test this because access to the feature is not available its always greyed out which I assume means I do not have the license for it. I think it is part of "Advanced Assembly Extension". Regardless there is no change to my save as copy struggle. This option looks to be the updated user experience version of what I already do but at additional cost.

 

Get data>Merge+Inheritance: I have read how this works, having access to the features inside the merge. I can see the use case but, I do not need it.

 

Have not found anything to make the copying of a level of completion part set easier.
I am starting to think what I could do with a mapkey but it would have a lot going on. Thought I would post this up first after my research came up dry. If no solution I hope this post can still be used by people trying to make merge parts without AAX

 

Best answer by StephenW

We do this regularly, usually 3 or 4 levels deep, but varies. I sort of got lost in your details thought so I'm not sure what your real question is.

We use windchill and save as using windchill along with making sure it is getting dependents normally works fine. If I need to make sure, which is usually the case, just make a workspace with all the parts and drawings I am duplicating, then select them all simultaneously, then select save-as so I am in full control of what is selected rather than depending on relying on windchill to find the correct stuff.

 

We use the get data - merge option almost exclusively. It does a great job. Using assy's can occassionally make reference (ghost object) that can't be undone if you accidentally save the assy.

2 replies

S
23-Emerald III
StephenW23-Emerald IIIAnswer
23-Emerald III
August 26, 2022

We do this regularly, usually 3 or 4 levels deep, but varies. I sort of got lost in your details thought so I'm not sure what your real question is.

We use windchill and save as using windchill along with making sure it is getting dependents normally works fine. If I need to make sure, which is usually the case, just make a workspace with all the parts and drawings I am duplicating, then select them all simultaneously, then select save-as so I am in full control of what is selected rather than depending on relying on windchill to find the correct stuff.

 

We use the get data - merge option almost exclusively. It does a great job. Using assy's can occassionally make reference (ghost object) that can't be undone if you accidentally save the assy.

    B
    BG_986910414-AlexandriteAuthor
    14-Alexandrite
    August 26, 2022

    This helped. I always did the save as in CREO. Not in Windchill. I just tested in Windchill with the multiselect then file save as operation everything is copied to a new set. Marvelous. Multiselect save as is the key. 

    Agreed the ASM method can cause ghost reference if not done right which is which I made the mapkey to cut down on mistakes. I think the ghost reference can be removed but its not a normal task. I remember having to fix some I found in Windchill but can't recall what I did. 

    tbraxton
    22-Sapphire II
    tbraxton22-Sapphire II
    22-Sapphire II
    August 26, 2022

    If I understand that you are capturing a part at stages of a serial manufacturing process then I would suggest you look again at merge/inheritance. This was one of the reasons that the inheritance feature was created when it was introduced. You can create the inheritance as an external (independent of an assembly). It is used extensively for as cast/as machined models as an example.

     

    Using inheritance you can complete the design in a single model and then use inheritance functionality to document a model representing each stage of the manufacturing process,

    B
    BG_986910414-AlexandriteAuthor
    14-Alexandrite
    August 26, 2022

    I understand what inheritance can do. It really opens the model up to being able to put all the stages into one model which can be really nice. How well does having it all done in one model play with Windchill publishing? Our Windchill creates stp files for each model to send to suppliers. Can Windchill be made to publish model reps at each stage of manufacturing from that one model file automatically?

     

     

    tbraxton
    22-Sapphire II
    tbraxton22-Sapphire II
    22-Sapphire II
    August 26, 2022

    I can not offer any meaningful insight into Windchill publishing as I have never used it. I am sure someone else who works in a Windchill environment can offer some insight on that. I have extensive experience using merge and inheritance to manage design intent in Pro/E and Creo but I am not a SME in Windhcill operations.

     

    There is some old reference material dating back to the introduction of Inheritance functionality in this thread (scroll down to the .zip file I posted) that you may find helpful in deciding how to use inheritance features.

    https://community.ptc.com/t5/3D-Part-Assembly-Design/Associativity-between-models-with-Toggle-Inheritance-option/m-p/794209#M123827 

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