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1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
Question

Family table craziness

  • May 24, 2010
  • 14 replies
  • 2904 views
This is what drives me stark raving nuts with Proe. I have an assembly
family table with 12 different instances of the assembly in it. You
know, the usual stuff: some parts and assemblies suppressed, others
showing, depending on the instance. Everything was fine on Friday.
Today, I have a number of instances that should show certain assemblies
according to the family table, but when I open those instances, lo and
behold, there's nothing there! Either I have 1-3 parts showing, or
nothing at all. Some of the instances appear to be OK, but many of them
are just missing major parts, even though the family table says they
should be there, and some are empty.

Am I just missing something? Does anyone know how to deal with this?

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
-

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14 replies

16-Pearl
May 24, 2010

One thing to always be wary of when using family tables is the domino
effect. Turning something off must not have children. I am sure you are
aware of that. However, as you build your matrix Pro/E in session can
fool you if not fully regenerated. I will purposely erase all from
session, even restarting Pro/E just to feel like the day after. This is
something I know web folks do. It's easy to miss something. I takes a
great deal of concentration as the table becomes more complex. There is
always a reason why.

On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 8:17 AM, Sauter, Kenneth W (SA-1) wrote:

This is what drives me stark raving nuts with Proe. I have an
assembly family table with 12 different instances of the assembly in it.
You know, the usual stuff: some parts and assemblies suppressed, others
showing, depending on the instance. Everything was fine on Friday.
Today, I have a number of instances that should show certain assemblies
according to the family table, but when I open those instances, lo and
behold, there's nothing there! Either I have 1-3 parts showing, or
nothing at all. Some of the instances appear to be OK, but many of them
are just missing major parts, even though the family table says they
should be there, and some are empty.
Am I just missing something? Does anyone know how to deal with this?
Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->
<">mailto:->
NOTICE: This e-mail transmission (and/or the attachments accompanying
it) may contain confidential or proprietary information belonging to DRS
Technologies or the sender. The information is only for the use of the
intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby
notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any
action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
prohibited. Any unauthorized interception of this transmission is
illegal under the law. If you have received this transmission in error,
please promptly notify the sender by reply e-mail, and then destroy all
copies of the transmission.
"This (document/presentation) may contain technical data as defined in
the International Traffic In Arms Regulations (ITAR) 22 CFR 120.10.
Export of this material is restricted by the Arms Export Control Act (22
U.S.C. 2751 et seq.) and may not be exported to foreign persons without
prior written approval from the U.S. Department of State."
kwsauter1-VisitorAuthor
1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
I am certain there is always a reason why. The reason we use this
software is so we don't have to worry about the background housekeeping
that is necessary to keep everything sorted out. It is the software's
job to sort out those things so I can spend my time designing. It's
like having a manual transmission and a manual timing control on your
car. Not only would you have to manually shift gears, but you would
also have to manually adjust the timing as the car speeds up or slows
down to keep the engine running properly. None of us would be willing
to put up with that. why should we have to put up with it in Proe?


Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->
1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
The biggest bugaboo with that issue is that it doesn't necessarily warn or
inform you that it's suppressing children. For example, if A is in the
family table but B isn't, and you inadvertently make B a child of A, it will
suppress B when A gets suppressed, you may not ever get any
error/warning/indication that B is now suppressed.



--



Lyle Beidler
MGS Inc
178 Muddy Creek Church Rd
Denver PA 17517
717-336-7528
Fax 717-336-0514
<">mailto:-> -
<">http://www.mgsincorporated.com>
16-Pearl
May 24, 2010

I agree it's pretty much manual. This may explain why many people don't
like to use them.

On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Sauter, Kenneth W (SA-1) wrote:

I am certain there is always a reason why. The reason we use this
software is so we don't have to worry about the background housekeeping
that is necessary to keep everything sorted out. It is the software's
job to sort out those things so I can spend my time designing. It's
like having a manual transmission and a manual timing control on your
car. Not only would you have to manually shift gears, but you would
also have to manually adjust the timing as the car speeds up or slows
down to keep the engine running properly. None of us would be willing
to put up with that. why should we have to put up with it in Proe?

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->
<">mailto:->
16-Pearl
May 24, 2010


Yes...that would be great.

16-Pearl
May 24, 2010

I agree it's pretty much manual. This may explain why many people
don't like to use them.

On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Sauter, Kenneth W (SA-1) wrote:

I am certain there is always a reason why. The reason we use this
software is so we don't have to worry about the background housekeeping
that is necessary to keep everything sorted out. It is the software's
job to sort out those things so I can spend my time designing. It's
like having a manual transmission and a manual timing control on your
car. Not only would you have to manually shift gears, but you would
also have to manually adjust the timing as the car speeds up or slows
down to keep the engine running properly. None of us would be willing
to put up with that. why should we have to put up with it in Proe?

Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->
<">mailto:->
1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
When we use family tables here we tie everything to a general skeleton to keep from having parent-child relationship to individual parts. Takes out some of the issues out of the family table.



Sincerely,

Rick L.
Design Draftsman: Husky Corporation



1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
From what I remember, the ‘preferred’ method lately has been to use interchange groups vs. family tables.



I can say that the interchange groups are much more robust and flexible, allowing for part or assembly replacements. We have even made ‘temporary’ interchange groups when we want to replace two unlike components in an assembly without hassle.




kwsauter1-VisitorAuthor
1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
Which raises the question: If the software is parametric (i.e., it
manages relationships between parts, features, dimensions, etc.) and we
have to eliminate relationships to make something work 'properly', does
the software itself work 'properly'? When you have to defeat the
advertised purpose of using the software, what good is the software?


Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->
kwsauter1-VisitorAuthor
1-Visitor
May 24, 2010
I have heard that interchange groups are limited to a very restricted
number of configurations, like 4 or so. Is that true?


Ken Sauter
DRS Reconnaissance Surveillance and Target Acquisition
Infrared Technologies Division
PO Box 740188
Dallas, TX 75374
214-860-6826
- <">mailto:->