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HugoHermans12-Amethyst
12-Amethyst
March 8, 2009
Question

No Layer Isolate in WF4??

  • March 8, 2009
  • 14 replies
  • 4947 views

What happened with Layer Isolate in WF4, see screenshot attached? Is there an option to make it available again?

Regards, Hugo.

<< ProE WF3 M190 - PDMLink 8.00 M040 >>

    14 replies

    B
    BrentDrysdale12-Amethyst
    12-Amethyst
    March 8, 2009
    Hi Hugo,
    This bothered me too. I asked Glenn Beer who did a presentation on Layers at Tampa (2007) where he promoted the use of Isolate. He thought it was there but then came back with this reply...

    "Oh! Yes! You can drag the isolate icon from the customize dialog into the text menu View>Visibilities. Where it becomes a new line item there."

    Why it is visible in the custom dialogue box and not in the menu in the first place I have no idea. Makes me a little worried that some folks at PTC do not really understand what Isolate does so do not worry about having it available (we thought we had lost it with the move to WF). I would like it on my RMB along with Hide and Show for layers. In the end I have also put the icon for Isolate in with all the other Layer Icons in my config.win. After suggestions from Glenn I have all my visibility Icons (datums etc, Layers, Views, View Manager) in a toolbar on the far left of my screen to the left of the model tree. His rationale is that this means the icons are always in the same location and I like this.

    Regards, Brent Drysdale
    Regards, Brent Drysdale
    Mechanical Designer
    Tait Electronics Ltd (www.taitworld.com)
    New Zealand
    Ph. +64 3 358 1093

    Hugo Hermans wrote:
    What happened with Layer Isolate in WF4, see screenshot attached? Is there an option to make it available again?
    Regards, Hugo.

    << ProE WF3 M190 - PDMLink 8.00 M040 >>


    G
    gkbeer1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 9, 2009
    PTC took it off the stock UI. You need to customize a tool bar to include
    the Isolate icon. It looks like an eye inside a dashed box. BTW It may not
    grouped with the other display status icons of hidden and unhidden.


    G
    gkbeer1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 9, 2009
    By not being grouped with, I'm talking about where the icon sits in the config.win customize dialog.
    G
    gkbeer1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 10, 2009
    Hugo,

    I blame PTC's documentation. Everything in the online help, for layers, is
    absolutely accurate, and absolutely useless for learning. It is convoluted,
    it tries to describe the visibility results in terms of the layer UI
    functions only. That is not enough. I can't help but believe that the
    original author, didn't get it.

    The documentation ignores the difference between features and entities. This
    dates back to when PTC was trying to differentiate Pro/E from all the other
    Cad programs. "Pro/E has Features, not entities" - I heard that many times.
    With that statement, Trainers couldn't talk about the difference. Or just
    didn't know. It amounts to the same thing.

    The documentation also ignores how layer status interacts with basic rules
    governing *inherited invisibility*.

    *Inherited invisibility *simply means that if an object is invisible,
    everything that makes up that object is invisible.
    Assy>parts>features>entities.

    With this, an item on a layer, can impact the visibility of items not on
    layers. Isolate is particularly powerful in this respect. This makes it much
    more useful than many give credit. I find it troubling, when I hear of
    people writing complex sets of layer rules, when by adapting to the use of
    isolate, only one rule per layer may be needed.

    Unfortunately, I don't think PTC will fix the documents, until there is a
    groundswell of enlightenment among the general population of users. Then it
    won't matter anymore.



    On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 12:30 AM, Hermans Hugo
    <->wrote:

    > Thank you, Glenn. Now you and someone else mentioned it, I remember it
    > was on the mailing list some months ago. I hope PTC wont drop it completely
    > in the future (although I have to admit it's use isn't widely spread).
    >
    > Regards, Hugo.
    >
    >
    D
    dgschaefer21-Topaz II
    21-Topaz II
    March 10, 2009
    I can't help but wonder if there isn't someone at PTC pushing for a
    simpler UI, maybe looking at the competition. It's likely, as you said
    Glenn, that they don't understand isolate. Only having show & hide
    prominent makes things a lot simpler, at least they seem that way.
    Layers are either on or off, right?

    On, off and isolate is harder to explain and would lead to more tech
    support calls to figure it out. Hard core users will call if we remove
    it, but it's too hard to explain to novices, so let's bury it.

    Too bad there's not a PTC or PTC|User wiki where users could document
    some of this stuff.

    Doug Schaefer
    E
    ehill1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 10, 2009
    Well let's be honest, here, the Pro/E help files have *never* been
    useful for learning any aspect of the software. They are that way
    intentionally - to promote a need for training and consulting.



    Isolate in particular has been always been glossed over ever since I can
    remember. Out of all the users I've encountered over the past 15 years,
    I can count the number who had any idea what isolate does on one hand,
    and have fingers to spare. I would wager that the reason it's not on
    the latest UI by default is that PTC ran some audits to track how many
    times a function was used, and if not used often enough, moved the
    pick/button off the main UI.



    Best Regards,
    B
    bhawley1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 10, 2009
    A Pro/E wiki? What a fantastic idea. Just think how much more useful
    that would be that the built in help (which I also find sorely lacking
    in most parts.)


    L
    lylebeidler1-Visitor
    1-Visitor
    March 10, 2009
    I got this from Jeff Zemsky at PTC in January.





    Wiki should be coming soon to the PTC/USER portal. The developer had is
    planned for Q1 of 2009





    --



    Lyle Beidler
    MGS Inc
    178 Muddy Creek Church Rd
    Denver PA 17517
    717-336-7528
    Fax 717-336-0514
    <">mailto:-> -
    <">http://www.mgsincorporated.com>
    H
    HugoHermans12-AmethystAuthor
    12-Amethyst
    March 10, 2009
    As I remember, there was the intention to add a Wiki to the PTCUSER
    portal. I still hope it will be available, some day.

    Regards, Hugo.
    D
    dgschaefer21-Topaz II
    21-Topaz II
    March 10, 2009
    There was a great presentation at PTC|User last year on how a company
    used a Wiki to share Pro|E knowledge company wide. I guess it was
    fantastically successful.

    Doug Schaefer
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