Let the Flames Begin...

Well written, well said.

I discovered Mathcad about the same time as you did.  (I started Mathcad on a Macintosh SE.)  And I used the program as a working engineer until I retired (in 2017.)  I never was a trainer, except when somebody asked directly; there were no Mathcad classes--the person in charge of maintaining the program for the company could never get enough people interested to justify an on-site class.  (All of our new hires came from college with a firm MATLAB foundation; the fact that I was doing in Mathcad with units what they were doing in MATLAB didn't convert them.)  Despite a significant difference in per seat cost, many engineers continued to demand MATLAB while the Mathcad seats were under used.  (My administrator would have been thrilled at a 33%  useage rate.)

I too skipped Prime 1 and 2, not useable for calculations, and supported version 3.  We never installed 3.1 (I don't think) and version 4 was rolled out just as I left; I don't know what they're using now.

Most of the new hires chose to use Prime.  Since I was monitoring, training, and teaching them I was "forced" to learn Prime, although I tended to reach for version 15 for my own calculations, especially if a quick answer was needed, or something special was required.  (Ever do a waterfall plot of an FFT over time?)

I agree with you that Prime is now useable, although my argument that Mathcad can do most of what MATLAB can would suffer badly.  And I agree that Mathcad 15 life span is nearly over.  PTC has really "dragged their feet" in bringing Prime up to where 15 was; there is still a lot missing.  (The ebook I put together for our group's specific needs is nearly useless now since it would require 15 to use it.)

Feels like we're putting down a faithful, trusted, loyal old dog!

I also first used Mathcad when it was a DOS based program. I even did testing on the earlier versions of Prime. While I don't need to use all the in depth math functions, I find Prime fits most of my needs.  Your comments on Prime's pluses and minuses are very similar to mine. As I have done a few e-books using Mathcad it is the one feature I miss the most. What I find inexcusable is the ability to save a Prime document to an earlier version of Mathcad, and to not be able to import xmcd document directly into Prime. 

My biggest problem with Mathcad Prime is the licensing process is a mess. The last two years it took me several weeks and several hours (after I purchased the license) with tech support to get a license that worked. 

Though I have a perpetual license for Mathcad 15, I still pay every year to use Prime because it has become so easy for me to use and I now have 10 years of Prime worksheets.

I have tried Matlab (yuk), Mathematica (to steep a learning curve) and SMath (ok for a tablet) and found them wanting. So JeffH1, I too have settled on Prime and will continue to use it as long as I can justify the cost.

OK, here goes...

Some of you may recall my post a while back about the history of Prime development, and how PTC ignored our technical committee voice for their "Prime" effort. I have used Mathcad since 1991 or so, and have a significant number of files that conduct a very wide variety of calculations - most all of which have been validated. As most of you long-time users know, many of these files cannot be converted without extra effort - some functionality cannot convert at all! This is how PTC's efforts differ from how you characterized it:

"When Microsoft moves their buttons around on every single forced update of Office, we don't go down and picket outside Bill Gates' house."

PTC didn't just move their buttons around, they left-out functionality! What would you think if MS Word removed all lower case characters, or the bullet or number list option from a newer, "more modern" version? What if they left-out paragraph formatting, or margin adjustment, or font choice or page breaks? What if MS took plots away from Excel? That one actually is equivalent to what PTC did with the first few versions of Prime! I could go on...but I won't. Yes, Prime has improved since v1, and you are correct to say it took too long - shamefully too long. I will admit I have not yet given Prime 6 time enough to pass judgement yet, but I will attempt to convert some significant tools I created a number of years ago to see how it works...or doesn't.

There will be a time when I do move on and migrate to Prime - I really do want to. PTC has added some very nice features we never had in Mathcad. But, I find it hard to think I'll need to fix most every file I've created. Admittedly, my dislike of this software does have somewhat to do with PTC's approach - remember, I was part of a very significant customer voice (CAE Technical Committee), which they virtually ignored...and it was a very vocal voice indeed! That's what boiled my blood more than anything - they had the input from very seasoned users to make Prime roll-out and move ahead quickly without much issue. I'll provide a follow-up when I've had enough time to put Prime 6 through its paces. But for now, Windows 10 is still planned to be supported by Microsoft until Oct., 2025, so we have some time left (maybe I'll try to figure out how to retire by then 😀).

 Im with you. Totally tired of every post starting with "real Mathcad".  I have been using prime for four years now and have no issues for what I need it for. The quality of final document produced is much better and I much prefer the user interface and modern look. 

We are on windows 10 and all apps should be 64 bit now people.

In addition to the features you mentioned, the new custom margin and footer option is great for making the Mathcad document match any type of existing report template. Also, ability to now automate printing to a PDF through expsoure of the API is huge. I still have to test this....

I have 30% Mathcad and 60% Prime in my new English  book

2⁵ Problems for STEM Education

(10% - Maple, Mathematica & SMath)

There were 50% - 50% on the origin Russian book! 

Hi, I'm afraid that.....

I'm probably one of those old Mathcad guys.  I, too, starting using it in the old DOS days and it has become my primary computational tool.  Like everyone else, I was appalled at the amateur efforts that produced the early versions of Prime.  I have hung on to V15 for the simple reason that it did what I needed and Prime sometimes didn't.

My only reason for avoiding Prime 5 was bad plot formatting.  If it was only me, I would have made do, but I'm a professor and I didn't want to teach students bad habits.  It looks like Prime 6 has finally fixed that, so I'm making the change.  V15 is familiar and I really like it, but it's ancient and needs to go.

Like many of you, I've been baffled by how PTC has acted.  However, I've been communicating with their customer support people and it's been positive.  They truly seem to want to improve customer support.  There's a lot to be done, but the buggy and byzantine web site is now much better.  Also, I have a Webex next week so they can see what the customer experience looks like from my end.  A company that didn't care wouldn't do this.

My only real concern at this point is licensing.  I had been avoiding PTC in favor of one of their outsource vendors, EAC and that pretty much solved the problem.  Still, the goofy, convoluted purchasing process is a hard sell to students who are used to Amazon and NetFlix.

If they have fixed the purchasing process - and I think they are trying to - my complaints will all have been addressed.  Time to move on.

Mark

All cool. I have a bunch of live illustrations (a scipted Autocad object, parametrically driven from calculation results). What would be the workaround for me?

I am not with you yet.

I have just started using mathcad prime 7.0.  Nine or ten years ago I saw the negative reviews of prime on the PTC forum and simply ignored Prime, 

I always maintained personal copies when mathsoft existed.  I thought it was a great tool; worth buying for home.  Couldn't afford to do that after PTC bought Mathsoft.

My company finally moved to Prime, I think for obsolescence.  We didn't even have a license server for Prime until the middle of this year.  I don't think anyone was interested.

I have gotten the conversion to work on a simple mathcad 15 file.  But there are no real improvements for basic usage.  I have many many mcd and xmcd files that I have accumulated over many years. 

For the solver why do they draw this goofy blue box around the equations?  I thought this was a free form input?  Mathcad 15 was.  I thought that was the point of Mathcad vs a scripting language.    It doesn't seem to recognize some of the equations in the box and seems to work poorly compared to the old Mathcad 15.  I haven't really spent much time with the symbolics, but it doesn't seem to be as easy as Mathcad 15.  In 15 just click on a variable in an equation and solve for that variable.  Fantastic!  I don't really see how to do that, at least easily, in Prime.

Why be an apologist Prime?  PTC has had 10 years,and tripled or quadrupled the price.. 

I will not use Smath for work because of its origin.  But I will move on for home use.  Likely to Smath studio or a open source symbolic solver with a graphical front end.  There seem to be a few around. 

Or just go with the flow and use matlab or octave,  However, Mathcad still shines with respect to those tools for documenting calculations.

After 10 years you can't even do a ctrl mouse wheel zoom.  Excusable for a so called tired old dog.  But at least the old dog symbolics and solver worked well.

Prime looks like a "not invented here" exercise.  PTC bought Mathsoft, and a team of developers with not much familiarity with Mathcad thought they could  improve the interface.  

I'm amazed how many grey hairs are around that have been using Mathcad since it was a Dos Program.  Likewise, I started in 1987 with version 1.0. 

MathCad 15 was really a bug fix for version 14.  Nothing really new in 15.  Before version 14, I was lobbying MathSoft to upgrade their kernel to a modern operating system.  The change was inevitable.  Around Prime 3, I found that it was workable.  I switched and tried to get over the grumbling.  I think that the real problem we all bemoan is that PTC bought Mathcad as an add-on to their CAD software.  It has always been the poor step-sister and not the flagship product it was under MathSoft.

I upgrade as soon as possible.  I am pleased that PTC has finally committed to a version upgrade annually.  Today, I use Primate.  It still isn't everything I wish it was, but there is nothing like it on the market.  Stop the whining and move forward.  I just wish there was a MathCad group in the PTC meetings.

Bob (aka RantEng)